127 responses to “Ron Paul: End the Wars, Stop Blaming Islam for 9/11”

  1. Ben

    This is a spectacular video! A TRUE conservative and TRUE patriot (unlike lil' Ronny Paul) had this to say to a Marine who asked him a question concerning people who always dream up rationalizations about why Islamic terrorist attacks are actually America's fault.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TkGQmCZjJ0k

    “The first you gotta do is you gotta study and understand who you're up aginst. And you must realize that this is not a religion that you're fighting against. You are fighting against a theopolitical belief system and construct. You're fighting against something that's been doing this thing since 622 AD. The seventh century. Thirteen hundred and eighty-eight years. You want to dig up Charles Martel and ask him why him why he was fighting the Muslim army at the Battle of Tours in 732? You want to ask the Venetian fleet at Lepanto why they were fighting a Muslim fleet in 1571? You want to ask…the Germanic and Austrian knights why they were fighting at the gates of Vienna in 1683? You want to ask people what happened at Constantinople and why today it is called Istanbul because they lost that fight in 1453? You need to get into the Koran…you need to understand their precepts. And then you need to understand, this is not a perversion. They are doing exactly what this book says.”

    Later, he continued. Take heed, Ronulans. This man could teach you something, if you're willing to open your mind.

    “Until you get principled leadership in the United States of America that is willing to say that, we will continue to chase our tail, because we will never clearly define who this enemy is, and then understand their goals and objectives—which (are) on any jihadist website—and then come up with the right (and) proper objectives to not only secure our Republic but secure Western civilization.”

    That principled leadership is NOT Ron Paul. He's part of the problem in Washington.

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    1. Lindsey

      Ben: Allen West is running for Congress in my district in Florida. He is indeed a true patriot and hopefully he will be elected to replace the socialist representative (Ron Klein) who we now have!!!!!!! People on this site need to see this video for sure!!!!!!

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      1. Ben

        I admire Colonel west very much. I wish I lived in his district so I could vote for him.

        Now there's a patriot. Men of the caliber are hard to come by in government today.

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    2. ProudTEX

      BEN - Did he answed the question?
      And what did anyone learn from the question’s answer? Continue the illegal occupation and immoral wars? - There is no winning on either side but alot of money to made by Neocons/Zionist.

      A house Nigro jumps to answer the question who's master couldn't answer well.

      Thanks to Malcolm-X for clearing this on this black and white video.
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=znQe9nUKzvQ

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  2. Ben

    By the way, we don't have a "policy of torture". I wish we did, but we don't.

    Ron Paul telling the Muslims this is only enflaming them. He's making our soldiers targets! Bad, bad, Ron Paul.

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  3. Ben

    Oh yeah, and this argument that he's going to make our soldiers targets--what bullshit. They say that about everything.

    If we don't build the mosque at ground zero, we're going to make our soldiers targets. If we support Israel, we're going to make our soldiers targets. If we don't trip over ourselves, obsequiesly declaring that "Islam means peace", we're going to make our soldiers targets. Whatever the Muslims say, we do it. You know what we could do to make sure that our soldiers are NEVER targets? We could adopt sharia law!

    Seriously, this idea that we should never make Muslims mad or we're inviting violence is the first step toward dhimmitude. We don't make our policy based on what terrorists will do in retaliation. If we do, then we're allowing them to set our policy.

    "As I have said time and time again, Osama bin Laden wins by ‘proving’ that America is an enemy of Islam and has an occupation agenda in the Middle East. And, we continue to walk into his trap and hand him up his best recruitment tool in his efforts to provoke hatred and terrorism against the United States."

    Oh geez, the old recruit tool chestnut. Listen, the Middle East is awash with bizarre beliefs that have no basis in reality. A majority don't believe that Muslims attacked the World Trade Center and the Pentagon. Most don't believe in the Holocaust. As if we could ever convince them that our cause is just.

    Any one of you blind Ron Paul followers should be able to answer me one simple question. How would Ron Paul have reacted to the attacks of 9/11 if he had been president? Go ahead and tell me.

    I know the answer to that question. He would have invaded Afghanistan with an open ended war resolution with broad, sweeping executive powers to go after the people who perpetrated the attack and those who harbored them. I know that because that was exactly what he voted to do in the September 14, 2001 resolution.

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    1. ProudTEX

      """"ANY ONE OF YOU BLIND RON PAUL FOLLOWERS SHOULD BE ABLE TO ANSWER ME ONE SIMPLE QUESTION. HOW WOULD RON PAUL HAVE REACTED TO THE ATTACKS OF 9/11 IF HE HAD BEEN PRESIDENT? GO AHEAD AND TELL ME. """""

      Sure, I will tell you..

      In a real state world, it is always location, location, and location.
      In a crime scene for any investigator, it is investigation, investigation and investigation.
      Once I was watching court TV, a female FBI agent stated; to find a murderer you must interview and investigate the people closest to the victim/scene and start growing the circle of your investigation but unfortunately the 9/11 investigation start from Iraq and Afghasiatan and the real criminal already cleaned up the crime scene and cashed their insurance paycheck and went to the bank. Now, our poor soldiers and poor afghans are stuck in a war that has no end and victory on either side.
      I don’t know if you call them victors, but the victors are those who committed the crime and went to the bank
      The real victors are the DOD contractors whom continue making endless money from these endless wars.

      Ron Paul 2012

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    2. ProudTEX

      """I KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION. HE WOULD HAVE INVADED AFGHANISTAN WITH AN OPEN ENDED WAR RESOLUTION WITH BROAD, SWEEPING EXECUTIVE POWERS TO GO AFTER THE PEOPLE WHO PERPETRATED THE ATTACK AND THOSE WHO HARBORED THEM. I KNOW THAT BECAUSE THAT WAS EXACTLY WHAT HE VOTED TO DO IN THE SEPTEMBER 14, 2001 RESOLUTION."""

      Sure.... I supported the war against Iraq too because we were told that they had illegal WMD but now no one can find it. Should we still support this war? What for?
      IRAQ WMD again - we ain't buying it anymore.
      IRAN WMD now - we ain't buying it....

      If anyone wants to fight these wars get together with your buddies and parachute you from the Air to Iran or Iraq and fight as long as you can.

      RON PAUL 2012

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    3. Bribo McBain

      The resolution wasn't open ended. He voted to go after Bin Laden and the perpetrators of 9/11. That's not open ended. People like you who misinterpret things are what made it open ended.

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      1. Ben

        You haven't read the resolution. You only believe what RP told you he voted for.

        RP lies to you. Read it for yourself.

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  4. Ben

    "...our policies of torture, targeted assassination, invasion of Muslim countries and unintended infliction of civilian casualties in Iraq, Afghanistan and Pakistan are also provocative. Pictures of victims of torture as well as innocent people killed by drones and stray bombs are every bit as bad as burning the Quran."

    Ah! So we deserve acts of every bit of terrorism we get from the Muslim world.

    Thanks for clearing that up, Ron. You're a douche.

    I wouldn't want to provoke the Muslim world. But then again, it doesn't take much to provoke them into a foaming-at-the-mouth rage. Think of cartoons. And Teddy bears.

    Look, Terry Jones is kind of idiot. I wouldn't have launched this publicity stunt. But he had a point to make about the Ground Zero victory Mosque that Ron Paul and other should make an effort to understand. Yes, those jerkwads have the right to build their mosque there so long as it conforms to zoning laws and building codes. (It appears that the building codes were waved for the victory mosque, by the way)

    But is it right? Is it a big middle finger at America? Yes, it is. If this imam was honestly stupid enough to believe that he was "building bridges" by putting it there, he should know better now that he isn't building any such bridges.

    So Terry Jones lept into action. He decided to threaten to do something that he had every right to do, but would nonetheless enrage a targeted group. I see his point.

    The Imam is ripping the scab off a wound. Of course, Ron Paul thinks that there's "Demogaugery" on "both sides" of the Mosque issue. Spare me, Ron. He highlights that the assholes who want to build their mosque have property rights and first amendment rights. Yeah, that's true. But when Pastor Jones wants to burn some books, he's doesn't seem to care that he has the right. He only seems to care that it's a needlessly provocative thing to do.

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  5. Kris

    Just to see a funny side of the whole mess, I think Muslims should actually be grateful to Terry Jones for what he planned to do!
    He would have given those copies of Quran a clean, hygienic end! I mean, just think of alternatives!

    Disposed of / unsold / replaced copies of Quran don’t actually go to some Quran Heaven where they lay safe and respected. They end up either on a dump, rotting away along things like non-halal meat (likely pork!), discarded condoms, alcohol containers, and all sorts of other things that are better left unmentioned. Or, if recycled, copies of Quran would end up in a mill where they get mashed with things like pornography mags, books of authors against whom fatwas were issued, holy books of other religions, etc. and then get turned into toilet paper.

    When you put the above into perspective, I think Terry Jones does not look all that bad, does he?

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  6. Lindsey

    The church I go to is sending 2 missionaries to Afghanistan. Any comments?

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    1. Ben

      Obviously, the missionaries at your church are unpatriotic Americans. THey're only going to make our soldiers targets!

      Don't they understand that Muslims are very sensitive people? Don't do anything to make them upset.

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      1. Lindsey

        The missionaries are helping people with necessities and witnessing for Christ.

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      2. Dan

        Why do people use the term unpatriotic or unamerican to an idea that they don't agree with. I think differently about many subjects on here but I don't consider anyone anti-america.

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        1. Ben

          I obviously don't understand the tongue-in-cheek nature of my post.

          Ron Paul's thugs regularly attack the patriotism of anyone who disagrees with them.

          The point I was trying to make was that Christian missionaries in a Muslim country are guaranteed to make Muslims mad. It will serve as a recruiting tool for al Qaeda! So we'd better not do it. Anything that could make Muslims mad is off limits.

          When Muslims say "jump" we say "how high".

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    2. ProudTEX

      You didn't say what for? Change them to an idiots like Ben?

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  7. Nitroindole

    Technical correction (sorry):

    Positive entropy - easy job, Evil way.

    Negative entropy - hard job, Good way.

    Yet the essence still is: Create, Do Not Destroy!

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  8. Nitroindole

    To all the discussion below let me to put it as simple as general and fundamental rule of mine:

    DO NOT MAKE HARM OF ANY KIND TO OTHERS!!

    Neither physical nor spiritual. At least, at least (!) try so. Only this would mean real RESPECT. This, by definition, includes both do not kill and do not insult.

    What is Evil? Evil is DESTRUCTION physical and spiritual (negative entropy, easy job!) and all deeds that contribute into it.

    What is Good? Good is CREATION physical and spiritual and deeds all that contribute into it (positive entropy, hard job!). Not to destruction and/or insulting of others!

    I do believe everyone in the Earth is able to understand and follow the above simple rule. While the rule is simple to follow it is hard job.

    I do believe in God my unique way. I do not belong to any denomination and do not want to.

    Let's stop making any harm to others and (!!) ourselves!!

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  9. James

    Terry Jones has or had plans to burn copies of the Quran sometime today, but if he were one that truly heard from God, then he would have been told to burn the government's official 911 Commission Report. That would be a worthwhile book to burn.

    The collective voices of these respected senior officials along with over 100 esteemed professors, over 200 pilots and aviation professionals, and hundreds of architects and engineers give credibility to the claim that the 9/11 Commission Report is tragically flawed. These dedicated individuals from across the political spectrums are not irresponsible believers in some 9/11 conspiracy theory. Their sincere concern, backed by decades of service to their country, demonstrate that criticism of the 9/11 Commission Report is not only reasonable and responsible, it is in fact a patriotic duty. -

    http://www.wanttoknow.info/officialsquestion911commissionreport

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  10. Mary Hath Spokane, alias Lady Liberty

    I for one do not believe the media story of 9/11. I have made an investigation. Here are my results:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMiqPQdWvo4

    There were no planes - photoshop forgeries!!
    But there was a 30' drone unmanned ball - photographed!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFIGeINof0Y&feature=related

    And there were tons of thermite and tons of molten steel [from jet plane fuel we are told?? Right!]
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ssuAMNas1us

    On Sept.ll, 2001 2,972 American citizens died. Now nine years later,. many Americans believe and fear it was an inside job done to create the invasion of a sovereign country which never attacked us causing 1,700,000 Iraq civilian deaths!! War made by one people on another must be recognized as national murder and the people who provoke that war condemned as murderers! The ones who perpetuated these murders must be held accountable......the very SOUL of AMERICA is at stake!!

    On the anniversary of the 9/ll event let us all demand the Congress of the United States to re-open an investigation. In the 9/11 Official Investigation questions went unanswered. The victims' families and the American people deserve to know the real TRUTH. http://www.wanttoknow.info/911video

    NOW, EDUCATE YOURSELVES...GET MAD...AND DO SOMETHING!! THIS IS ABOUT MURDER!

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    1. Ross

      Mary,You are being very selfish.How can lying deceptive industrial military complex make a dishonest living with people of intergrity like you around?
      You should know your place and be more considerate of your facist superiors.

      There is only $ trillions to be made in the arms industry and not only that the poor old US Fed is forced to counterfeit your money and loan it back to you as debt .Now give them a break.All they wany to do is to make profit by murder,destruction,stealing energy/resources and then charge you the tax payer a fortune to rebuild their economies.

      Just think of the other great noble things they are achieving.They are saving the environment by getting hate filled humans to exterminate each other via lies and deception.

      They've been doing this for centuries and the moronic masses still get sucked into the same old wars..WW1 was to be the war to end all wars.

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  11. Al Treska

    I thought after being a Marine infantryman in Vietnam in our worst year for casualties, 1968, that nothing in my lifetime would come close to that unnecessary mess. But our interventions in Iraq and Afghanistan seem at least in a spiritual sense to be worse than all of our years in Vietnam.

    I voted for Dr. Paul in 1988 when he ran for prez. I'm glad he is still with us as a sober voice of Reason. (A bit of a plug there for the libertarian monthly. wink)

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  12. Darwin

    The root of the muslim's hate of america begins with the weapons U.S provides to israel that kills muslims there

    If the united states put a more pressure on israel for making diplomacy instead of using military force would be a positive start

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  13. James

    Terry Jones is now doing the two step and he is not going to do the book burning. The Imam says that he did not make any decision to not build the center in NY. The MSM is having a field day with all of the hype and confusion. Mr. Paul has said during an interview about the Muslim center, "And we do know that the people who attacked us on 9/11 were Muslims." - http://video.aol.com/video-detail/ron-paul-nyc-mosque-demagogues-peddle-hate-to-justify-war/7320996 - I have never seen any positive proof that would make that statement true, or anything even close to making that a true statement. There are many testimonies of what occurred on that day from eyewitness rescue workers, police and firemen for anyone that would take the time to listen to those who were there to see through the government cover up documents in their final 9/11 report. Nine years later with expert reviews by architects, scientists and those that work in the field of building demolition proves that this could not of happened by planes hitting the buildings or by the burning jet fuel. The government was quick to identify the hijackers by name. Half of these so called hijackers came forward to prove they were alive and had no involvement with what happened. And still this government says it was nineteen hijackers that committed suicide on those four planes and continues to give the names of those that have proved themselves alive and innocent of these charges. The traps have been set for all of us by corrupt administrations one after another that make policies to allow torture, target people for assassination, invade Muslim countries and inflict casualties against innocent civilians. I respect Ron Paul. I am saying this because if we are to change this nation back into a Republic and take it out of the hands of those that are out to destroy it, we must have truthful politicians that have viewed all evidence and listened to all the testimonies and reviews that point the finger in the right direction of those guilty. Anything less will allow those who are the guilty to walk free and to continue their evil endeavors to destroy the United States and the American people.

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    1. David

      Wonderful James;

      Its absolutely amazing the sheer volume of people in this country who are putting things together, seeing through the deception and realizing the culprits behind all this and their agenda to gain absolute power and control over the single and only country left in the world where any form of freedom still exists. Seems to be the vast majority by now as well.

      Americans are definitely not the stupid trusting sheep that exist in the rest of the world and they've figured this out before the power has been established to prevent them from doing anything about it and i expect that before too long they will. They have made me very proud of them once before and i expect they will do so again.

      Per my post further down, they do need to actually do something instead of just talking as were well past the point where they know what needs to be done and i expect that many are already doing so as we speak. This will be the generation which finally kills the concept of Banking and introduces the very much needed economic renaissance which will shift our government and economy over from a system of theft and fraud designed to create shortage to buy power for a few parasites who contribute nothing to it, to one designed to fuel abundant and ever increasing useful production and prosperity for the benefit of the population. Both the banks and the government they established are living in absolute terror of us at this point, as they know we have figured this out before they could take away our guns and if we can increase that terror in our political establishment just a little, then i think we can get them to revolt against their masters who put them in power, fulfill their constitutional responsibilities for our benefit and we wont ever need to use them.

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    2. Nitroindole

      You are right guys but to me there is not much basis to be optimistic... How many Americans do need and do dig the TRUTH? Polls show that average less than ~ 30-40% and the ignorant rest are satisfied marching under propaganda brainwashing trumpets, supporting wars, provocations (burning Qurans), big government’s lies, cover-ups and general agenda. I am afraid we have very low chances of rebuilding the Republic.

      However Dr. Ron Paul weights a lot in favor of those chances.

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      1. David

        Well, it was exactly 5 % of the American population who participated in and brought about the first American Revolution and one man, Thomas Payne, who published a book giving the population the concepts of freedom and justice which they could work toward accomplishing and did.

        There's a great many of us on here who have been participating in the effort for a long time and have been copy pasting posts containing ideas of a free economy and the problems that exist today and potential solutions to them from this site into emails and forwarding them into circulation among the general public. As this effort has been progressing so has the hatred among the general public toward the current powers and the suffering which they have inflicted on them along with the realization that things do not have to be as they are and can be changed toward their benefit as well.

        Now i think we've come up with the simplest possible means to force this change to occur:

        http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/fiat-money-inflation-federal-reserve/comment-page-21/#comment-126876

        and if enough once again participate in this effort and do their part as individuals to promote it and get it into circulation where everyone in America can see it and act on it, then i expect it will happen as well, quickly, simply and easily.

        Don't discount the method either. Email forwards are a geometric progression, its like having a penny, doubling your money every day and at the end of the month you'll have $ 10,000,000.00, $ 20,000,000.00 if the month has 31 days. 5 minutes of effort from one single person in helping to get these things into circulation can result in them ending up in the hands of millions, and there is absolutely nothing that anyone who would want to prevent this can do to stop it, so instead of giving up, just help, and lets see what happens.

        You are right, the definition of a "normal" person is that they don't dig for the truth as they are generally absolutely terrified of having to think and want to be told what to do, but they have been pushed to the point where they know that those who have been doing the telling are the enemies which will destroy them and that they have to do something. If those of us who do think and dig can put the solutions and the means to accomplish them in front of them, they will act on them as well.

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    3. Ben

      "I have never seen any positive proof that would make that statement true, or anything even close to making that a true statement."

      Bullshit. You've seen positive proof, you just refuse to believe it because you're batshit crazy and you prefer to believe nonsense.

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  14. Rob

    This guy sounds like a Nazi. I think American Foreign Policy is more to blame for 9/11 than islam.

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    1. ksh

      Ron Paul, a Nazi? R U Serious? LOL Surely you just misunderstand his argument. Geez!

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      1. ksh

        Sorry - I tried to change my statement but the web site refreshed itself and did not allow me to edit the above/ I understand the post meant the pastor was acting like a nazi, not RP.

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  15. Douglas

    I fear, those (Elite) who control the media have a specific agenda for this 'book burning' event. One that will let them get away with another staged unthinkable terrorist attack. This pastor should seriously consider the opportunity he is currently giving the Globalist Elite. They are going to use this event to their utmost advantage. Yea and on top of this will come the random fanatical violence of Muslims.

    What I understand is that the Private International Banking Families (Elite) who own and control US and many Nations of the world ‘must’ be able to exploit the natural resources of Afghanistan, Iraqi and Iran in order to keep their civilization going.

    I postulate. If America and NATO 'fail' to stabilize and contract these countries then the Elite will have no choice but to influence and cause ‘China’ to the Job. China helped to finance this War because they stand to benefit from the exploitation of all these countries natural resources.

    I postulate. I am not convinced that the Zionist Elite will be able to maintain control of a massive Asian military invasion of the Middle East. However, if they give China a lead role in the representation of a cashless world currency system, China may, in return, curb Iran so the Zionist can have their little Nation in Palestine without any posing threats.

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    1. David

      HI Douglas;

      Yes to assume that there was not some sort of agenda and that the F'ing parasites who currently have consumed 60 % of this countries wealth and want to make it 100 % in the next couple of years are not going to use this in some way would be extremely foolish.

      In terms of China, i expect that if we do not get rid of the parasites we are going to end up in a very nasty war with china at some point which we may very well lose. If my information is correct they have one of the very few economies in the world which functions on real state issued money as opposed to bank debt and the banks have to destroy China in order to accomplish their ambition of ruling the world. Given a choice over enslavement by the world's banking system or the Chinese, i sort of expect that the latter would be the better alternative as it is the far lesser evil of the two. In terms of the religious arguments they will accomplish absolutely nothing in terms of saving America and restoring it for the benefit and control of its population, this has been going on for well over 1000 years, and nothing has changed in that time. LOL when i was young, my father was a history teacher and he brought home one of his textbooks one day with a drawing of some English knight who had some Moor by the throat, and was about to run him through with his sword. Some kid had scribbled a caption underneath the photo which stated "this will teach you to fart in church" The battle between christian, jew and moslem still goes on, always will, and only involves us thanks to our stupid involvement in the affairs of other countries. America is not a christian nation, nor is it a moslem nation and the first amendment of our constitution ensures that by guaranteeing both freedom of religion and freedom from religion as well.

      Who wants this battle of religion to continue for the sake of creating ever more debt and finally securing the same complete and total ownership of America and its population for themselves, just as they already have over our currency and economy, and most of the populations in other countries in the world already ?

      Rothschild Banks of London
      Lazard Brothers Bank of Paris
      Israel Moses Seif Bank of Italy
      Warburg Bank of Hamburg and Amsterdam
      Lehman Brothers Bank of New York
      Kuhn, Loeb and Co. of New York
      Chase Manhattan Bank of New York
      Goldman, Sachs of New York

      Who are the enemies that we need to destroy in order to take back our country and economy for the benefit of ourselves, before Thomas Jeffersons prediction of the children waking up homeless in the land that their fathers conquered becomes the final reality ? The same F'ing banks.

      Anyone hoping to resolve things through the electoral process may as well give up right now, guess who owns stock in and votes on the boards of all the major media corporations and why Ron Paul was given absolutely no coverage in the past presidential election and never will be ? Guess who has the power to assassinate him 2 days after he takes office even if we somehow circumvent the power which would prevent us from having a chance to vote for him in the first place, just as they did Lincoln, Kennedy, Garfield, and would have done to Jackson had the pistol not misfired ?

      Get busy people and make this happen, if all you put in your own individual efforts toward promoting the solution and act on this yourself i think it will. Quickly, simply and easily too:

      http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/fiat-money-inflation-federal-reserve/comment-page-21/#comment-126876

      The banks can assassinate any president, they can assassinate every member of the senate, but they'd have an awfully hard time assassinating every congressman and every member of the American public, so it has to be we the people who destroy them first so that they can no longer try. This stupidity has gone on long enough. Hopefully this can be done simply by terrifying those in our political establishment into revolting against the banks which have put them in power and acting in our interests, allowing us to elect those who would do it willingly later on.

      Get your asses in gear people and make it happen, if enough of you do then this will work and if not then be prepared to grab your rifles and do it the hard way. This sh*t has gone on long enough, we are at war and one way or another we have to win it now. Stop pissing around with pointless issues, were out of time. What does any of this have to do with Islam and Christianity and of what consequence are either of them to what we need to bring about to save ourselves ?. Not much from what i can see on this end. Stop pissing around with pointless issues, were out of time.

      Whether you are Christian, Moslem, Jew, Hindu, Bhuddist, wicca or any other form of religion, doing this will ensure your continued freedom and abundant prosperity such as you have never experienced before. Given the pre-existing freedom to practice each of your religions as you see fit in regards to yourselves, it would seem that dropping all other arguments and acting together toward all of our collective benefit would be the only sensible course of action for anyone to take and the source of making all of the other manufactured problems disappear at the same time.

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  16. kristin

    All we are doing is falling right into the ignorant hate-trap. We DO have the right to burn any book in this country and it makes it alot easier when the book to burn is the foundational faith for these extremists. Yes, burning our flag and urinating on the Bible is wrong, but DONT FALL FOR THE HATETRAP!!!. That is what they want, some fire up our arse. I personally would just burn the book just to get rid of it (get it out of circulation) and not make a scene, not announce it to fuel some fire that a burning brightly on it's own.
    Christians especially should not play into this, SETTING A BAD EXAMPLE FOR NON-BELIEVERS OF CHRIST. thanks:)

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    1. Ross

      Kristin,We should not also fall the the other hate trap ie Jewish or black hatred.

      It is the old game of divide and conquer that elites have played throughout the centuries.eg My enemy's enemy,is my friend.

      Wall St and the big banksters are trying to play us all off against each other.They know that we know and their panic mode has them caught in a time warp.

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  17. Bill

    "Under Jones’ warped logic, we should have attacked Saudi Arabia since 15 of the 19 suicide bombers came from that country"

    Interesting, is there any relationship between the NYC Muslim Center and Saudies (funding)?

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  18. kwulf

    "HOLY" WAR IS INEVITABLE. LET"S PROVOKE IT NOW SO WE CAN GET IT OVERWITH.
    1. I support the right to burn any book as a form of protest.
    2. I support our right to defend ourselves against violence should muslims anywhere be inclined to attack Americans or our allies in response to the Koran burning.

    Despite what our military leaders say, provoking a hostile enemy to irrational action can be a good thing, because it can bring the enemy out in the open on our timetable, so we can identify all its force components.

    If the Muslim world wants to declare holy war on everyone else, and they want to use a backwater pastor as an excuse to do so, then bring it on, it was bound to happen anyway.

    Realistically, some muslim leaders will declare war and incite their followers to violence, and some will not. The ones that do will be more easily targeted and taken out. Gangs of muslims acting violently will be more easily found and killed or captured.

    But open war will force each muslim on the fence to PUBLICLY decide if they want to support sharia medieval brutality or modern government and peaceful plurality. If they choose the former, they start down the dead-end road to the ash heap of history. If they pick the latter, they will need to separate from their radical brethren as a rufugee or be killed by them.

    But at least we can eventually sort em out. We won't let them operate as sleeper cells. We will find them, and we will kill or imprison them.

    That's where this is all going. Face it folks, this has been coming a long time. It is time for another world war. War is the normal state of human affairs when large groups of humans demonize another enough to kill innocents intentionally. That is where we are with at least 20% of the Islamic world. Humans only learned to trade with groups speaking other languages 120,000 years ago. Peaceful trade is a young idea, and it has never been accepted worldwide. Many tribes simply do not trust outsiders.

    In ten years, we will have millions of publicly radicalized muslims interned in, or exiled from modern nations, and the muslim nations will be isolated economically and militarily. There will also be millions of muslims who will create a modern faction which renounces jihad and violence, so that they will not have to live in muslim ghettoes.

    Sleepers will still kill us at significant rates for many years, in protest of sanctions, and that will not likely end for centuries. Unfortunately Big Brother policies will need to be used to ferret out sleepers. I hate this, but it is also inevitable.

    Our better angels are far in our future. Meanwhile, we must fight to survive.

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    1. jim

      I don't think Jesus' message was be christain when it's convenient.

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      1. Dfens

        I won't come here to find out what Jesus' message was.

        "Do not think that I came to bring peace on the earth; I did not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I came to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and a man’s enemies will be the members of his household. He who loves father or mother more than Me is not worthy of Me; and he who loves son or daughter more than Me is not worthy of Me. And he who does not take his cross and follow after Me is not worthy of Me. He who has found his life will lose it, and he who has lost his life for My sake will find it." -- Matthew 10:34-39

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        1. Nitroindole

          So what? This citation implies that you condemn even your close relatives if they do not follow His law, His 10 commandments.

          Treat others in the way you want they treat you.

          And what is your interpretation? Instigate and cut off heads? Burn Quran?

          We have 1000 + 1 problem in this country where economy of paper fiat money is expiring along with the pride of the Nation. Yet they want you and me forget about that, but instead burn Qurans, burn sombody's countries, hate and keep killing. And you respond readily... to Satan, not to Jesus. Like a sheep..... Bee-e-e-e-e-e-e.

          So who the hell Christians are, show me where they are and what they are doing these days??????

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        2. Dfens

          Where are the Christians? They are being killed and oppressed by Muslims in Indonesia while their brethern in the US and Europe look the other way. They are being killed by Muslims in Somalia and Ethiopia, but what's on the other channel? 3,000 Americans, mostly Christians were killed right here on our home soil in an operation funded by Saudi oil money on 9/11 and where are Christians? They're busy driving to church in their SUVs. After all, we wouldn't want to offend anyone.

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        3. Nitroindole

          I mean real Christian must not kill, that is what New Testament says, isn't it?

          And what is your attitude to the fact that 500,000 Iraqi children under the age of 5 have died in Iraq since the imposition of U.N. sanctions in the 90-s??? Did the effect (which one?) worth those half-million deaths?

          Christians kill each other and kill others for over 2000 years under a variety of "righteous" pretexts. No one really follow Jesus in the Earth....

          Another question is: Who is going to benefit out of another bloody war between Christians and Muslims? Not too hard to guess, those who belong not to either ones. So who they are?

          Do you like playing their deadly game??? Do you want another bloddy war?

          If answer is NO, then please do not provoke it. Otherwise we all will regret.

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        4. Dfens

          "I have come to cast fire upon the earth; and how I wish it were already kindled! But I have a baptism to undergo, and how distressed I am until it is accomplished! Do you suppose that I came to grant peace on earth? I tell you, no, but rather division; for from now on five members in one household will be divided, three against two and two against three." -- Luke 12:49-52

          Yeah, Christians don't kill and we turn the other cheek, and we keep not killing and turning the other cheek until it becomes clear that our enemy has become intractable and has confused meekness with weakness and then we kill them in numbers that make the Biblical plagues look like a sunny afternoon in the park. There is no religion in this world that can rain hell fire and destruction upon the Earth like the Christian religion. And if you don't believe that, just keep on f'ing with us.

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        5. David

          Hi Dfens;

          Well in terms of relevance to political discussions i'll simply stick with our first Amendment, but i do share your faith.

          Christ did set several examples for us:

          He cast out the money changers which we urgently need to do at this point and which i expect the American people are about to do at long last.

          He confirmed our second amendment by instructing his disciples that if they had no sword, to sell their cloak and buy one, with your quotation being relevant to this as well, by establishing that freedom can only be established and maintained by presenting a threat to the power that would prevent it. This again the American people have done (for which i am very proud of them) which is exactly why they currently have the means to present such a threat in order to accomplish the former.

          He established that freedom comes from the shedding of blood, as he shed his own for precisely this purpose, as did the founding fathers of this single and only nation on earth which is based on principles of freedom which he himself adhered to. He established this as an act of love as well in that "greater love has no man than that he would be willing to lay down his life for a friend", which again is precisely what these individuals did, and what he did himself.

          Hopefully people will be wise enough to organize themselves and act collectively in order to destroy the power which threatens their freedom and has destroyed their prosperity peacefully so that the original sacrifice of love by our founding fathers can be sufficient, but if not, i expect that there are more than enough who would be willing to make the same sacrifice in order to restore these things as well. I also think that there are a great many Americans who do not share in our faith who would be willing to make the same sacrifice for their country and their fellow citizens as well and this makes them equally noble and equally American and is after all what defines an "American".

          "I do hereby solemnly swear to defend the Constitution of the United States of America against all enemies, both foreign and domestic".

          Seems like the domestic enemies are the ones we need to get rid of and without Banks to involve us in wars and enforcing their power across the globe for the sake of creating more debt and buying more power and ownership over America for themselves, the foreign enemies would pretty much disappear of their own accord. We would be of little consequence to them after that other than the fact that they would all exist in order to serve the massive purchasing power which the American population would be able to create for itself without Banks to control and restrict their prosperity.

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        6. jim

          That quotation is not about a literal sword. It is about severing any bond that you would put above the one you have with God. Since you only will go to the bible for it's understanding, please explain these excerpts.

          Do not repay evil for evil. Be careful to do what is right in the eyes of everybody. If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone. Do not take revenge, my friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the lord. On the contrary: "If your enemy is hungry, feed him; if he is thristy, give him something to drink. In doing this, you will be heaping hot coals on his head." Do not be overcome by evil, overcome evil with good (Romans 12:17-21)

          But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those that curse you, pray for those who mistreat you (Luke 6:27-28)

          Do not repay evil with evil or insult with insult, but with blessing, because to this you were called so that you might inherit a blessing (1 Peter 3:9)

          Anyone who claims to be in the light but still hates his brother lives in the darkness. Whoever loves his brother lives in the light, and there is nothing in him to make him stumble (1 John 2:9-10)

          Try to remember Jesus says he is the sword. Not us.

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        7. Dfens

          While they were enjoying themselves, some of the wicked men of the city surrounded the house. Pounding on the door, they shouted to the old man who owned the house, "Bring out the man who came to your house so we can have sex with him."

          The owner of the house went outside and said to them, "No, my friends, don't be so vile. Since this man is my guest, don't do this disgraceful thing. Look, here is my virgin daughter, and his concubine. I will bring them out to you now, and you can use them and do to them whatever you wish. But to this man, don't do such a disgraceful thing."

          But the men would not listen to him. So the man took his concubine and sent her outside to them, and they raped her and abused her throughout the night, and at dawn they let her go. At daybreak the woman went back to the house where her master was staying, fell down at the door and lay there until daylight.

          When her master got up in the morning and opened the door of the house and stepped out to continue on his way, there lay his concubine, fallen in the doorway of the house, with her hands on the threshold. He said to her, "Get up; let's go." But there was no answer. Then the man put her on his donkey and set out for home.

          When he reached home, he took a knife and cut up his concubine, limb by limb, into twelve parts and sent them into all the areas of Israel. Everyone who saw it said, "Such a thing has never been seen or done, not since the day the Israelites came up out of Egypt. Think about it! Consider it! Tell us what to do!" -- Judges 19:22-30

          So they fled before the Israelites in the direction of the desert, but they could not escape the battle. And the men of Israel who came out of the towns cut them down there. They surrounded the Benjamites, chased them and easily overran them in the vicinity of Gibeah on the east. Eighteen thousand Benjamites fell, all of them valiant fighters. As they turned and fled toward the desert to the rock of Rimmon, the Israelites cut down five thousand men along the roads. They kept pressing after the Benjamites as far as Gidom and struck down two thousand more.

          On that day twenty-five thousand Benjamite swordsmen fell, all of them valiant fighters. But six hundred men turned and fled into the desert to the rock of Rimmon, where they stayed four months. The men of Israel went back to Benjamin and put all the towns to the sword, including the animals and everything else they found. All the towns they came across they set on fire. -- Judges 20:42-48

          The tribe of Benjamin was nearly wiped out of existance, why? Not because they were all homosexual, but because they refused to stand up against the immoral acts of a few of their fellows. The time has come to choose a side.

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        8. What a bunch of primates.

          All religions cause hate and murder.

          How ironic that the ones who claim to be the most enlightened cannot recognize evil for the life of them.

          Indoctrination alters the logic center of the brain. Google it.

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        9. jim

          To Primate

          All religions cause hate.

          All races cause racism.

          All nationalities cause ethnicism.

          etc. etc. etc.

          Blanketed generalizations are never true. They are stereotypes that over-simplify an issue. They make everybody clones in a collective group. This is simply false.

          You also said Religion alters the mind.

          Everything alters the mind. Reading any book will alter your mind. You read something, and your brain always associates new information with old stored information. You begin strengthening old synaptic responses, and newer synpatic responses. You will do this by drinking large amounts of water as well. I will tell you how religion affected me when I was young. I heard the parables every week and didn't really understand much because hey I was kid. Then one day I heard a song, I was about 5. It is the first thing I can remember clearly understanding at church. It went, " When I was hungry you gave me to eat/ When I was thirsty you gave me to drink/ Now enter into the home of my father/ For whatever you do/ To the least of my people/ That you do onto me. That is the oldest synaptic response I have. Yes, it altered my brain. I have taken that to be the key message of Christainity.

          As to Dfense... we simply have very different intreptations of the Prince of Peace's message. I always thought his message was,"Faith, hope and love and the greatest of these is love." You seem to believe something else. We will have to agree to disagree.

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        10. Primate

          To Jim

          Don't get me wrong, I consider myself to be tolerant of just about all belief systems. If a grown man wanted to believe in santa clause or the boogey man, that would be okay with me. The problem arises when bodies start turning up because of conflicting mythological beliefs. Apparently, not everyone is as tolerant as I am.

          I also agree that blanket generalizations are inaccurate. What I don't agree with is your notion that hate and murder as a by-product of religion is some how as naturally occuring as race or ethnicity. People can't pick their race, but they can pick their beliefs -- unless of course they were indoctrinated.

          Teaching children to hate or dislike people because they have a different belief, race or ethnicity is wrong. That's regardless of what some ancient book says.

          There is absolutely nothing wrong with spiritually appreciating a religion, or becoming enlightened, or being at one with the universe, or whatever you'd like to call it. I do understand the positive aspects of religion. People need to understand, though, that in order to have your religious freedom respected in society, you must also respect the religious freedom of others. Just because you told me that santa clause isn't as cool as the boogey man, it doesn't mean I am justified in harming you.

          In a couple thousand years the majority of mankind will likely view the religions of today in the same way we look at Greek mythology now, and we will probably be better off for it since there haven't been too many Zues-related wars lately.

          P.S

          The effect of indoctrination on the brain is much deeper than simply forming memories and connecting brain cells. Studies have shown that indoctrination is capable of effectively shutting off the logic center of the human brain.

          Think about it. This would explain all of these crazy results religions have been giving us all of these years.

          My point is that it's time for man to grow up and stop fighting over invisible friends.

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        11. Dfens

          'I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot; I wish that you were cold or hot. 'So because you are lukewarm, and neither hot nor cold, I will spit you out of My mouth. 'Because you say, "I am rich, and have become wealthy, and have need of nothing," and you do not know that you are wretched and miserable and poor and blind and naked, I advise you to buy from Me gold refined by fire so that you may become rich, and white garments so that you may clothe yourself, and that the shame of your nakedness will not be revealed; and eye salve to anoint your eyes so that you may see. 'Those whom I love, I reprove and discipline; therefore be zealous and repent. 'Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will dine with him, and he with Me. 'He who overcomes, I will grant to him to sit down with Me on My throne, as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne. 'He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.'" - Revelation 3:15-22

          You people make me sick. You want to live on your bellies, then live that way. Know this, though, in life there are choices, and you will be judged on the choices you make. I choose to live like a man.

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  19. Anthony

    Burning books is always a bad idea. Blanket belief that a People, a race, a civilization are evil is also a bad idea.

    These are the same bad ideas the Nazi's had.

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  20. Denny Bakhtiar

    No jews harmed in 9/11

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  21. jake

    If only astronomy were the religion of the world, we'd be at peace. All of this worshipping of invisible wizards in the sky is for naught, showing the asinine nature of the human condition. Would anyone argue that killing in the name of Zeus to be anything other than ridiculous? What's the difference, then?

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  22. Ross

    http://patriotsquestion911.com/

    220 +senior military, intelligence ,law enforcement and Govt officials.

    1200+ Architects and engineers

    400+ Medical professsionsals

    400 Professors

    250 Pilots and aviation professionals

    300 Survivors of 911 and their families

    200 Artists and media professionals

    See the long list of senior ex - military who question 911. Have all the above people taken leave of their senses? End all the theories and have an thorough and open investigation into 911.

    Those who live by lies and deception shall perish by them.

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  23. Bottomline

    Burning the Quran is like burning the American Flag! So if those who claim to be christian, then why are they doing these immoral acts! Islams are not the problem! We need to look @ ourselves and repsect the 1st Amendment and Freedom of Religion and others from Religion!

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  24. Lynn Parks

    There is a lot of heated discussion regarding the burning of the Koran/Quran but I keep thinking about something my mother taught me when I was a kid...how to put the shoe on the other foot. In other words, how to look at a situation from someone else's point of view. And regardless of how emotionally charged people are about the issue as a whole, if they are Christians they would not take it lightly if some (minor) religious group decided to burn the Bible regardless of the reasons cited by the people doing the burning.

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  25. Dfens

    I'm going to be there -- armed. Anyone else out there packing, and I'm not talking about guns?

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    1. Ross

      Armed with what Dfens? I hope it is logic. Would you care to debate the real facts of 911?

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      1. Dfens

        I'm happy to debate with honorable people such as yourself, Ross. Unfortunately not everyone is honorable. I'm ready for that too. It's practical.

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  26. Ross

    There needs to be a new independant investigation into 911.There was a third building that came down that day WTC 7 which housed CIA,FBI and ENRON offices.Very few people know about WTC 7.No plane impacted WTC 7 and at 47 stories high came down it's own foot print in 6.5sec. It took 6 yrs for NIST to put out a sham report on WTC 7 which they have now retracted.

    We have undisputed proof of freefall physics that proves beyond any doubt that it was impossible for this building to come down this fast and in this fashion.We also have proof from a team of 10 international scientists led by Prof Neils Harritt that nano thermite a highly sophistocated military explosive was used in all buildings of 911.

    For the scientific evidence see http://ae911truth.org/

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  27. Farukh

    Radical Islams ? Sure there are loads nowadays (well I'm definitely not one of them) but you made them ! Because of the fake story of 9/11 , you wanted the oil (which is largely in Muslim countries!). If it was in a country where the buddhism/Christianism/Hinduism or any other religion or spiritual stuff was practiced, you would have blamed them.

    You created the radical Islamists and all the shit which goes with that. So now PLEASE get on with it ! It's your own fault, you've got bloods on your hands ! IT'S TIME TO WAKE UP AND FACE the bloody music !

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    1. Dfens

      I hope I can find a copy of the Koran with nice, soft pages before the burning. Not Charmin soft, mind you, something more like Northern. Strong enough to take a load. My copy is going to be used. Well used. It should lend the proper aroma to the event.

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  28. Kris

    Although I am a huge fan of Mr Ron Paul, I for one support the idea of burning Quran on 9/11.

    The reason being that it is now such an unimaginable thing to do! Where is the liberty? If I buy a copy of Quran I can do whatever I want with it. It is plain rude and insensitive to burn an item of religious significance to other people, especially publicly, but this should never enter the political agenda as it has, and should never be blown out of proportion as it has been.

    It seems the western world is all too happy to self-censor, and to apply the most blatant double standards in order to try to appease the people they are on the other hand murdering and enslaving! This is madness.

    The freedom of speech and one rule of the law for all are more important that sensitivity. It is said that a religious minister feels compelled to make such an rude thing as burning Quran, but it seems the only way to show that some of us refuse to be bullied, censored and intimidated under twisted pretences of not hurting Muslims’ feelings.

    Quran is a holy book of Muslims. If they want to legislate its status and introduce penal system in their countries for disrespecting it then fine. But we must not bow to these alien rules in our countries. We must not give way and adjust our values and our way of life as per radical Muslims’ standards.

    As for infuriating and provoking non-militant Muslims, tough luck! We have every right to live our lives the way we want to even if it’s not in conformity with their religion, and we should make it known! If we’ll just keep doing everything to their liking soon we’ll be nothing more than slaves under the Muslim rule.

    This is not about aggression or expansion against Islam, this is about liberty of Muslim world to do as they please in their countries and our liberty to do as we please in ours.

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    1. Yousef Abed

      Hey guess what kids, the mosque is still going to be built on "ground zero" after it gets built what are you racist bigots going to complain about next?

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    2. Travis

      Paul never made mention to the minister not having the right to do what he is planning, niether did the general to my knowlege.

      So I agree with you to the extent that the minister has the right to do whatever he wants to his own copies of the quran.
      People also have the right to burn the American flag, the bible or whatever else is their own property.

      People also have the right to voice out their opinions on the matter and express any distaste they have in their nieghbors action or support.
      That is all that is going on, I'm not really against people weighing in on the situation. Because they have the right to their opinion.

      As a Christian I am strongly apposed to this open act of disrespect towards another faith and think the hate filled idiots like this minister make it embarrassing (in a way) to be a Christian.
      This is not completely unlike the hate filled "God hates fags" agenda.
      Christ said the world would recongize us by our love and would follow his example.
      Jesus spoke very boldly and I don't think he was quite the pacifist that people paint nowdays but the people he came down on weren't the pagans (think of the woman at the well) but the hypocrits (think of the pharisies).

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    3. Nitroindole

      Hey Kris,

      You are almost right in your selfish logic but missing one critical fact:

      By actions of US government and US military we USA got our liberty to do as we please in THEIR countries (Islamic countries!), including burning their countries, like Iraq. Can you see???

      And if this is still not enough for you, go ahesd burn everything you can.

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      1. Kris

        As you rightly noted it is US government that is killing Muslims in their homelands, not me or Terry Jones.

        The hate towards USA comes from innocent people being killed, countries being invaded and occupied, governments being corrupted and manipulated by US officials. Not from some insignificant pastor burning a copy of Quran.

        And while politicians organise and carry out these sinister deeds they have the nerve to patronise, scare, censor and intimidate US citizens into some weird submissive servitude towards Islam. This is simply an opportunistic assault on freedom of Americans. Neither radical Muslims nor US government have right to violate constitutional freedoms of US citizens and if it takes insensitive gestures to remind people of that fact, then so be it.

        Do you really think that normal Muslims care more about some pastor in Florida burning Quran more than about all the bombings, torture, unlawful imprisonments, occupation, trade blockades?

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        1. Nitroindole

          No, I do not think that.

          But burning Qurans is as provocative as killing of prince Ferdinand and burning Reichstag! These insignificant deeds led directly to WW I and WW II.

          If we the people really want proving that we still have some of our liberties left then we need to stop UNCONSTITUTIONAL WARS in the first place, stop unconstitutional theft fiat money system along with the Fed and start follow our Constitution Law in reality, not in our dreams.

          And, you right, burning Quran is insignificant. Is this the ONLY our liberty left?

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        2. Nitroindole

          One more thing. Outside the US they do NOT distinguish between you and me and our corrupted government. For them we are all the same - Americans.

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        3. GB

          What made them "their countries"?

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  29. Darrell Young

    I don't know why people are acting as if Christians & Catholics in this country haven’t committed the worst hate crime. We still have built churches where the slaves lived. At that a location where they killed hundreds of black people. Its only white people that are mad about this. WHY is that. We do we still dwell in the past haven’t we criticized and stereotype people long enough without knowing anything about them. If you ask me all RELIGION is bad. But that is just how I feel.This is supposed to be the land of the free. Now they are kicking the Mexicans out of AZ. Like they aren't the real immigrants to this country. But that’s another story. Vote Dr Ron Paul 2012. Lets get this right people. But with you being on this site I assume that we already have your vote

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  30. Nikki

    He's only a Republican because belonging to a major party gives him better recognition and a better shot at the ballot. He has urged people to vote independent and the only reason why he doesn't run as one is because their are only two parties that get airtime in MSM news. He has admitted this.

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  31. Moby

    But, but...he's a republican! How come he doesn't fit into my narrow perception that all GOPers are the spawn of satan?

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  32. bruce

    I agree what this so called christian is doing is unnecessary. childish antagonism. I liken it to muslims putting a cross in a jar of urine or building a mosque at ground zero. It does not however compare to say... Chopping an americans head off, then putting a video of such on the web. Or flying airplanes full of americans into buildings full of americans. I also agree we did not need to start two wars, we had the technology to handle the problem differently. As I understand it this same so-called christian was burning non- king James versions of the bible a while back. If he does choose to burn these Korans, do you think the media will report that story even 1 out of every 10 times they plaster the koran burning story on our TV screens. If there was any responsibility in media, this story would not see the light of day.

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    1. Travis

      Your comparison of the actions of the so called "Christian" minister, who is a intsy winsey minority in the Christian religion to the intsy winsey minority of so called "Muslims" who carried out the terrist acts you described ....
      You do realize you're compairing minorities, who do not practice what their faith teaches, that have grabbed the spotlight that seems to be representing the entire religion?

      And if you realize this, why are you making a connection with the Muslims in NYC to the ones who attacted the twin towers?

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  33. Buck Molson

    I hope those people have a change of heart about burning the Quaran.

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  34. jim

    And for the Hawks in the republican party do they believe any of these statements???

    - The world is for the meek -

    - Turn the other cheek -

    - Let he without sin cast the first stone -

    - FORGIVE THEM LORD for they know not what they do -

    Maybe, just maybe, some Muslims are angry not because we are christains but because we don't act like christains.

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  35. jim

    Why did Brutus loss the argument to Antony in Shakespeare's Caesar??? Because Brutus talked to the people's reason, while Antony spoke to their baser side. Do we make that mistake now??? Thanks for being a true renaissance man Dr. Paul.

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