Ron Paul returned to the Alex Jones Show to discuss a wide variety of issues, including the latest economic developments, the real inflation rate, his growing coalition with Ralph Nader against corporatism, the struggle against militarism, auditing the Federal Reserve, and the prospects of Ron Paul running for President in 2012.
Alex Jones: OK. Until the end of the hour, Congressman Ron Paul joins us. And there is so much to talk about with the congressman. Of course, his son is Rand Paul, now the junior senator from Kentucky. And we’re very excited to have him here with us today from his Lake Jackson office. Congressman, a Happy New Year to you.
Ron Paul: Thank you. Same to you.
Alex Jones: There’s so much to talk about here. Out of the gates, you’re now the chairman of that Banking Sub-Committee dealing with the Federal Reserve. And it couldn’t be a more perfect time as the New York Times announces the federal government is preparing to basically take the states in under receivership and their bankruptcy. And as the Chinese openly say that it’s time for the dollar to not be the world reserve currency. Can you speak to your concerns. A few years ago you said something big is about to happen. Are we now on the cusp of that?
Ron Paul: We certainly are. And it’s going to get a lot worse. Even though we had this major crisis starting in 07-08, I thought that was just the beginning. Because the real crisis comes with the dollar. People lose confidence in the dollar. The dollar doesn’t deserve the confidence that it has. But you can put confidence in something that isn’t real if you’re deceived. And people are deceived that we’re really wealthy and we have a great military and therefore we can trust the United States, because of our past performances. But eventually that is eroded and people will reject it. And I think that we’re witnessing that with the Chinese. The Chinese have, sadly I guess, in a way, they have become more capitalistic than us. I don’t care about them becoming more capitalistic. But I don’t like the idea that we become more militaristic and more socialist. And that’s what’s so bad. But they have their problems in China. But just think of what they’ve done. They produce and they save money. They take the money and they buy up resources around the world. They buy gold. They’re a wealthy country. They loan us all this money. They’re in the driver’s seat. Don’t you think that, if you or I or any American was involved in that, we wouldn’t be wanting to just be taking paper money that they know is going to depreciate. There would be a limit. And I think we’re at that point. And when that happens, that will be a major event. When the world rejects the dollar. So, when it comes and how it comes and how quickly it comes, those are still unknowns. But it will come and I think we’re starting to see it happen right now.
Alex Jones: Absolutely. Congressman, as a doctor, as a congress person, as someone who has been on the Banking Committees for many years and has studied Austrian economics, for those that don’t know, comparing our situation to the Weimar Republic, I see a lot of similarities. We’re already seeing inflation in commodities and inflation in food. What is the basic time frame that you see currently and, for those that don’t know, what does dollar devaluation, the dollar losing world reserve currency status mean for people?
Ron Paul: Well, it means higher prices and eventually higher interest rates. Which means higher prices again. But the government always reports statistics that are deceiving. And they tell us that inflation is like 1.5-2 percent. And yet, if you talk to the average person, they know the price is going up. And you’re right about the commodities. There was a report yesterday, I think it was the S&P commodity index. For last year, a whole group of commodities it was up 24 percent. That’s huge. And you can’t have that and not have that translate into day-to-day living. And people know this. The energy prices are going to go up. And it wouldn’t take much to push oil up over $100. It’s bouncing around there already. Which means the standards of living go down. If an individuals borrows and they get into debt but they live high on the hog. And they buy more cars than they need and have a fancy house. And their job is just marginal. But if they lose their job or prices go up, they get wiped out. And they have to…in order to get back on their feet again, they have to work harder and spend less. It’s a little different with a country, because they have this printing press and they’re able to tax people. But there is a limit. But the economic law is the same for the country as it is for the individual. The country eventually has to live beneath its means and that’s what we’re witnessing now. And it usually hits some people more than others. So the middle class and the poor get hit the first. They lose their jobs and they hurt the most through the inflation. The very wealthy, actually there’s a transfer of wealth. This has been argued by Austrian economists for decades that, when you destroy your currency, it erodes the value of the currency. But the middle class suffers the most and the wealth is accumulated by the very rich. This is what we’re seeing.
Alex Jones: And we see that?
Ron Paul: We’re seeing that. And what does it do? It drives up resentment. They don’t fully understand this. The middle class is getting wiped out. They only have anger. They might strike out. Everybody who has wealth, rather than the wealth that has been accumulated because of the government programs.
Alex Jones: And the social engineers, as you know Dr Paul, Congressman, they’re fully aware of that. The pressure from above and below. And so right when they got rid of the Glass-Steagall 11 years ago. We start seeing Rand Corporation reports. We start seeing Department of Defense reports saying we’ve got to basically set up a police state because there’s a danger of social unrest coming because of the dwindling middle class. And now we see a British Ministry of Defense report saying the same thing in 2007. And, low and behold, now Homeland Security is putting in in 9,000 locations telescreens saying “Watch your neighbors”. Three new videos were released yesterday, frightening videos by Homeland Security airing on TV. They’re up on infowars.com and prisonplanet.com. And if listeners want to see it, or if the congressman hasn’t seen it. And it’s got people in shopping malls and on the streets. And it shows DHS, TSA on the streets searching people. And it says “We’re going to protect you but we need you to watch your neighbors”. Clearly they’re trying to bring in an authoritarian system not for Al Qaeda, or these overseas reported threats. But they’re now shifting it over to domestic groups. And we saw their attempt to attack Conservatives and Libertarians and yourself and myself. And even Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh in talk radio and the First Amendment after the tragic shooting. So, can you speak to that, sir, and this conscious movement towards authoritarianism?
Ron Paul: There’s no doubt about it. And you’re absolutely right about the disruption that comes to the communities. Because it is there. Most major changes occur domestically. We take an oath of office to obey the Constitution and defend it against enemies, foreign and domestic. I usually make that point. And even in the very, very patriotic crowds and veterans which you think would be more hawkish, if you emphasize the domestic threat, they understand this. But I think we’re actually winning this argument about this need for militarism around the world to protect ourselves and that we have to worry about it domestically. Because people are getting tired of having somebody from the government check every single thing. Back again to China, you can start businesses easier in China than here. People who have land, people who want to start a business, people who have to pay these high taxes and pay for all these regulations, they are starting to realize this. So, I think there’s a healthy resistance developing. But if we’re not there, there is some danger here and that is, of course, if we get people to understand where the cause comes from, we might be able to prevent this. See, the one thing, the one coalition that we should build…we talk a lot about the poor getting poorer, the middle class being wiped out. But the Left always thinks well, the answer to that is just more transfer of wealth. But we have to get them to understand that the reason this happens is because government is too big, even though they argue for government programs. The government is too big. They argue for these programs and guess who lost their homes? The rich got richer and the poor people lost their homes. Because of this program. But the big…the other big issue is to make sure that people know that corporatism is not free market economics and that’s a misunderstanding.
Alex Jones: Well that was my other point. And I’m glad you got into that. Because we’re of the same mind because we studied history. But quantify that for listeners who may be new, the ultra-Robber Baron, non-free market, crony capitalist always, as Carroll Quigley said at Georgetown, as Bill Clinton’s mentor, lobby for authoritarianism, whether it’s right wing, left wing, fascist, socialist, communist. Because they create this big pool of collectivized wealth. And they take it offshore. And now the ultra-rich are trying to sell the poor people who are losing their jobs on higher taxes and looting their neighbor who’s got more money than them. Selling them the lie that that’s going to give them a good economy, when it’s freedom that’s going to give them a future.
Ron Paul: Yeah, and then they lump everybody together. If you are a businessman, and there are a lot of very decent, wealthy businessmen in this country that earn and didn’t have to live off the government. But they get lumped into that. So, when there’s unrest, everybody is still lumped together. Whether they’re the people who lived off the government, live off the taxpayer. Whether they were successful because they delivered good products to consumers at good prices. So, there’s a big difference there. And you know, I’ve had some discussion with Ralph Nader, and I imagine there are a few of your listeners that can’t stand Ralph Nader. But I like to talk to him because we do come up with some agreements on this. He hates this corporatism and he doesn’t like the war. I work with people who can agree with me on some of this. So, this is what we have to do, is make sure our definitions are clear. Then we have a better chance of solving these problems.
Alex Jones: Very well said. Congressman, we’re seeing riots all over the world over global inflation driven by the devaluation of the dollar and other fiat currencies. You’ve been mentioning unrest here. And clearly we’re seeing more and more signs of that here. And I remember you back in Austin giving a speech that I attended seven years ago. We were talking about it during the break when you first got on. And you warned that, when the empire starts collapsing, there’s two ways to go: it’s either recognize that big government breeds corruption and go the opposite direction towards liberty. But that more often than not, instead the government is going to sell even more of the same, as the solution. So now is the time to get this out to people. This is a life and death situation for our republic, is it not?
Ron Paul: Yes. And it’s hard teaching people some of these lessons in the midst of a crisis, because then, and you can understand the emotions when law and order breaks down, most people say “Well, just quit the killing, calm down things. You’d better bring more police in.” And that’s a pretty natural response. But not realizing that we have had too many policemen already, and too many bureaucrats and too much federal government, too much taxes and all that. So, to me the earlier the education occurs, the better. I think people have to know and understand why it’s in their best interest. That the free market works better. People think that you have to sacrifice and all this. I don’t think you have to sacrifice a thing. Freedom, if you get your freedom, you don’t have to sacrifice anything. Because you have your incentives. You can take care of yourself a lot better than the government. And that’s a system that has worked. And unfortunately we’re about to give it up. And that’s why I fear the day when law and order breaks down. But questioning whether there’ll be riots in our streets like there have been overseas already. And I suspect that the American people are like other people. Even in the 1960s, we had our riots and our shares of problems here. So people will act in a violent manner and that’s up for grabs. And all factions then will be looking to get to powers and the strings of government. So, we have a big job ahead of us.
Alex Jones: So, we’re going into some very stormy waters?
Ron Paul: No doubt. It’s coming.
Alex Jones: Congressman, no doubt you’ve probably heard about it or seen it. But CNN, MSNBC, Democracy Now, they all singled you and I out specifically and played clips of you speaking your Texas straight talk and clips of my radio/TV show, where we talked about the Second Amendment being there. And it’s in the Declaration of Independence. It’s in the Bill of Rights. To defend against crime on the streets but also against a tyrannical government. And they have tried to now demonize and imply that you and I and others are the progenitors, in an asinine way, of what happened in Tucson, which we now know was a schizophrenic who was politically a Liberal. I’m not blaming the Democrats. But what do you think about the desperation? We saw Rachel Maddow and others go after your son and tell a laundry list of Dr Rand Paul. And, of course, that backfired on them. It only seemed to boost his approval rating when Clinton went campaigning against him. Now we see them doing it against you and I because they see us as a threat because we’re getting the truth out. What is your view on a) the ratcheting up of their rhetoric. Congressman Steve Cohen calling Republicans nazis a few days ago. And the fact that it’s backfiring in every case from the polls we’re seeing?
Ron Paul: There’s a limit and that says something for the American people. Maybe they won’t buy into that. But they’re certainly going to make the effort. And this is a frustration for me because I do make a diligent effort to try to work with honest, straightforward people who may be called progressives and liberals. Because some of them are decent and they’re honest. But they’re not these demagogues and those people who turn on you. Their goal is more like the promotion of the Democrat party, or promoting of government power. So they might say they agree with us on a couple of issues. But I sort them out. And some of them…the ones you’re talking about are just the demagogues, who may once say one thing and say “Oh yeah, we don’t like this, we don’t like that.” But then they’ll turn on you and they’ll do anything to maintain their power or to discredit us for what we’re doing.
Alex Jones: And it’s also hypocritical. They’re demonizing the First Amendment talking about fairness doctrine for talk radio, FCC, jurisdiction over the internet. This has all been announced while Matthews is calling white people “crackers”, Maddow is implying that we’re causing violence. The congressman is calling Republicans “nazis”. It’s just incredible how they’re trying to balkanize and turn the American people against each other.When you look at the polls, Liberals, Conservatives, Libertarians, almost everybody is against the banker bailouts, the wars. I mean the momentum is shifting towards freedom.
Ron Paul: No doubt about that. But there’s still a lot of people… I think that you can see it at the grassroots level. That is the case. Our problem has been…it’s taken a long time to build the bureaucracy. And when you think of these millions of people who are living off the government and work for the government. They work in Washington. They’re embedded into the political system. And so many in Congress, they have all clung to these views that they’ve held before. But the American people are further ahead. I think the people are always ahead of the politicians and hopefully we’ll win out on this fight. But, unfortunately, the opposition has a lot of guns. It’s interesting how they want to take our guns away. But everything the government does depends on a gun.
Alex Jones: It’s all about…
Ron Paul: It’s their guns against the guns of the civilians. But whether it’s tax collection or telling you where you can dig a ditch on your land, and how you can use your land, you may be accosted by a federal agent with a gun. Everything they do has to be enforced with a gun. It’s a trap. They never talk about that kind of gun violence. How often have they been barging into houses, into the wrong houses with guns blaring and blowing up the places and looking for drugs that didn’t exist and not even apologize. And never compensate these people. And sometimes hurt and kill some of these innocent people. And that’s the kind of gun violence that ought to be rejected.
Alex Jones: Absolutely. Mao Tse Tung said “political power grows out of the barrel of a gun”. Well, we’re the people and that’s our check and balance. Congressman, in the eight minutes we’ve got left with you, we have a prisonplanet.com, infowars.com headline: Congressman, Senator or President, as you know, a lot of big scientific polls, The Hill newspaper, the Democratic Affiliate Public Policy Polling and others are finding that you’re in the number one or number two seat to win the Texas Senate race for U.S. Senate if you so choose. And at the same time, you’ve won the CPAC coveted Republican straw poll while giving an anti-war, anti-empire speech. I have to just give you my opinion. I believe as running for president, you don’t have as good a shot as winning, though you do have, I think, a pretty good shot. But you’ll have a much more powerful educational platform, I’d say ten times bigger than 2008, going into the critical crisis. But if you go for Senate, you probably got a better chance of winning Congressman, and of course, I think you’d have even more power with the filibuster in the Senate. Congressman Ron Paul, the question a) what are you looking at there and b) you said the people, if they’re behind you, and if things continue to deteriorate like this, that folks will listen to you more. That you may run. I believe you’re going to run because it is the right thing to do and we win just by you running. Being able to educate people. Where do you stand on this? Whether people are chomping at the bit to know. And I saw your quotes in the news saying that you are interested in the Senate polls you’ve been seeing?
Ron Paul: Unfortunately, I’m still very ambivalent about all this. Usually, I’m not ambivalent on my views and what I do and what my plans are. But it does require a major decision. A personal decision, a family decision, a political decision. All these things. So I’m pretty undecided on what to do. And I think it through. People keep asking me: “Do you think about doing this”. And I admit that I do. I think about it all the time. Not because I wonder what I’m going to do with the rest of my life. But I often think about it because, when I get on radio talk shows, they ask me these kinds of questions. But I’m still pretty undecided on what I should do and what I can do and what I’ll end up doing.
Alex Jones: I challenged your doctor and now senator son when he was really just exploring it more than, I guess a year and a half, two years ago. And I said “Look, Rand, you’re going to win just by injecting real ideas. And I said: “I believe you will win.” And, because…I’m no political rocket scientist, but I can look at the field in Kentucky. I can see the Tea Party movement that your supporters started four years ago, three and a half years ago. And look, he’s there, he’s won. He went through hell, but he’s there. And he did the right thing for his country and for humanity. You, just as I asked you on air and off air before you ran for president very earlier on, I know many others did, I said “Congressman, I know it’s rough on your family.”, the attacks, the physical danger but I said “You’ve got to do it.” And you’re a man of conscience. You’re a man who has a big heart. And I know from your actions and your fruits, but also my discernment. He’s the real deal. I don’t think you have any choice but to run for president. And, or bare minimum Senate. And it is your destiny, Congressman Ron Paul. You’re almost forty years of standing up for liberty. And, so I’m drafting you right here and I know my listeners are. And if your health holds up. You’ve taken care of yourself. Barring that, I just hope and pray, sir, that you do run for president. And I think the sooner you announce, the better, so we can get the money and the energy and the grassroots behind you. And I want you to know you’ve got my full support of our millions of listeners.
Ron Paul: I appreciate the comments. It’s just that…it’s just real difficult. The one thing I can assure you and all your listeners is that it would be pretty hard for me to pack my bag and go and retire and live quietly thereafter, hereafter, and not be involved. But regardless, I’ve been in and out of office… I’ve run for offices. I’ve won some, lost some. The one thing is: it would be very hard for me to exist without working diligently to promote our cause. Which is the cause of personal liberty and things that I believe in. Because I believe this is how people have an opportunity to improve themselves and live freely and creatively. So, I’m convinced of all that. So, whether it’s in political office or whatever, I will be working as hard as I can to promote that cause.
Alex Jones: Well, we know that. And even if you just did the debates and didn’t beat yourself to death flying everywhere, even if you did it electronically, which I think is the most effective. I think a lot of campaigning is outdated with the focus on the individual getting out there in person. Even if you did it electronically, and you’ve got to run office because of the educational points. But, obviously, we respect your decision and we’ll appreciate you and support you regardless. But you can see, as Julius Cesar said, there is a tide in the affairs of men when taken at the flood leads onto fortune. And the fortune we seek is the jewel of liberty, as Thomas Jefferson said. And that jewel must be guarded jealously. And you are the great guardian of that jewel. Of anyone in the world, you are that light standing out like no other. And I don’t think that you’re going to not run and, my God, I know you are. And, Congressman, we just, really from the bottom of our hearts, want to thank you for the great work you’re doing. We’ve only got about two or three minutes left. In closing, taking sights on auditing and then reforming, abolishing the Fed, where do you stand with your periscope sights on that great [...]?
Ron Paul: I’m looking forward to that and I tried to get a hearing in January. But Congress is still disorganized because it’s newly created. So, in February the hearings are going to start. I did find out, also, that the rules prevent me from insisting that Bernanke come before a sub-committee. He only comes before a full committee. That’s just the way the rules are, like the Secretary of the Treasury too. But it doesn’t keep me from pursuing all the views that we have to have, exposing the Fed, transparency of the Fed, teaching people why the Fed is responsible for the booms and the busts and the unemployment and the inflation. It is a hot topic. It’s going to get hotter. And we are going to have our side well represented. And the hearings are not going to be huge. Sometimes they have six and eight people come for hearings. Ours will be smaller and they’re going to be very deliberative. And there’s going to be debate going on. I believe we’re going to get a lot of attention. I think we can achieve a whole lot by this. And, especially, as we move into this crisis. Because then, once we expose the Fed, then we better start talking about a transition and how we get out of this. Already, you know, the opposition, those that the World Bank talked about, yeah, we might have to have a new currency. Maybe we ought to use a little bit of gold. So, they want to neutralize us a little bit but they want to control everything. So, this is going to be our challenge. What we are going to replace the system with. That’s something I’ll be working very hard on.
Alex Jones: Well, Congressman, as you know we’re here at the crisis. They’re going to try and use it to get even more power. We’ve got to deal with it now. And there you are. Historically at the perfect time and perfect place. Have a great week-end coming up, Congressman Ron Paul. And we’ll talk to you again soon. Thank you for joining us.
Ron Paul: Thank you. Good to talk to you.
Alex Jones: Good to talk to you.