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Lew Rockwell: Well, how great it is to have as our guest this morning Dr. Ron Paul. Ron Paul is, of course, the leader of the Freedom Movement, a long time member of Congress, an author of a number of books, including three New York Times best-seller books in a row, including “Liberty defined. Ron, I noticed that the LA Times did a fun article yesterday where they looked at all the candidates’ books and, of course, your book was the best seller by far. So they noted that you had already won the book primary.
Ron Paul: That’s pretty good news. You know how I believe. I think you have to win the intellectual fight before you win the political fight. So I’m more interested in that anyway, but it might be a good omen that the political fights are going to come up pretty well for us, too.
Lew Rockwell: Ron, I was thrilled by your latest … by all your, sub-committee monetary policy hearings. But this latest one where you were grilling these two Federal Reserve lawyers, I thought that was quite an extra-ordinary moment. Tell us about the purpose of those hearings, what do you think they accomplished?
Ron Paul: Well, I wish they could accomplish a lot more, but just exposing the system, I think, is the best accomplishment. You know, because of the Freedom of Information Act, the lawsuits done by FOX and also by Bloomberg have revealed a lot of information. And, of course, I made fun of it because they gave us 29,000 pages and everybody calls it “the dump”. In the hearings I said, “I know of this guy that was being audited by the Federal Reserve and he dumped everything in a bushel basket and he dumped it on a desk, and he went to prison for that”. But here, the Federal Reserve can dump it on us. And then the one section that we paid a lot of attention to, because you can’t read 29,000 pages … but the one section we took and concentrated on was the section that actually introduced that they had another lending facility that not many people have talked about at all. And in that 300 and some pages, over 80% of the pages were redacted, you couldn’t read anything, it was blackened out. He did give a feeble answer and say, “Well, if you’re specific, you can come back and yes, we’ll let you read that part.” But you wonder, you just wonder what goes on in their minds. They think that this is going to satisfy the people. But the other thing that we concentrated on was how do they decide who gets bailed out and why are you too-big-to-fail but too little to get some help. And also, why the concentration on foreign bailouts. There was one period of time where 88% of all the discount loans were going to foreign banks. And, of course, the guy from New York, and you know how important the New York Fed is, I asked him precisely because essentially a 100% of the activity at the New York Fed was to send money to foreign banks. And, of course, I suggested but didn’t get a very clear answer, that maybe all a foreign bank has to do is open up a branch bank in New York and they have an unlimited line of credit to the New York bank. So this sort of internationalizes the system. But I think it’s all a game they play because I think it’s in the interest right now of the financial people to prop up the dollar. I think the dollar is artificially high. Everybody is worrying about it being low, but I think it’s artificially high because there are too many people who have an interest in it. But I don’t expect too many straight answers, we’re going to fall off with a lot of written questions and if they avoid it completely, then we might have to talk about a subpoena power. But right now we’re just going to pursue the process the way it’s being done in the past.
Lew Rockwell: Ron, what an extraordinary thing it is. I mean, here is the Federal Reserve, these rulers of the world, as they see themselves, and unfortunately all too often they are the rulers of the world. And for so many decades, they’ve been untouchable. I mean, not only were they not to be criticized, we were not even supposed to be interested in what they were doing, just accept that they knew best and shut up and go along with the program. You have made this – what they do, what they hide, the very (?) of the Federal Reserve – for the first time controversial among regular people, and for that matter, among the Congress. Nobody in the Congress, except you, cared about this sort of thing. So isn’t this just by itself intellectually and politically and culturally, a huge bit of progress.
Ron Paul: Oh yes, and even if next week or next month or next year we don’t get everything we’re asking for, which I suspect will be the case, we’re winning because they’re on the defensive. They have to hold the press conferences, they have to sort of spin what’s happening now. But what they cannot bear is the burden of their failed policies, and their policies are failing. Just think of the statistics that came out today. The economic statistics are horrible with unemployment and all these problems, and they’re starting to talk about a double dip recession. I’ve argued it’s only been one big dip and this so-called “recovery” didn’t exist, all they did was print money. So their system is failing and it’s going to become more noticeable. The reason we’re winning is they’re not going to just blame Congress for not spending enough money, which they have generally done in the past. But now they’re going to say who ruined the money, why are prices going up? And now, instead of saying, “Well, the solution is to stop these people from making profits and what we need are wage and price controls”. We’re going to have to put control in the Federal Reserve and bring them down to their knees because the people are going to get angrier and angrier, and we have to get them to direct their attention in the right place. Today, you can see the anger building, because even if there’s a Republican proposal that is a very token cut; they’re suggesting in 10 years now, we might cut something. I mean there’s a lot of anger. People believe that entitlements are rights. So we’re in for a big mess. But our numbers are growing and we need the general population to realize that the Federal Reserve can’t get off the hook on this and this is really, like you said, very encouraging that we’ve gotten their attention.
Lew Rockwell: I got a note this morning from a young economist who just read your book, “The case of Gold”, which was the minority report of the U.S. Gold Commissions written back in the early 1980s. He said, “I can’t believe it, Dr. Paul predicted everything that’s happened. Everything he said, this is going to happen, it happened.”
Ron Paul: Ha ha ha, yea. Well, I don’t feel like I take the credit because you know what I’ve studied in the past and I think the economic theories of the Austrian school have been correct and this has helped me analyze things. So it’s not like I’m (?) and say, “Oh yea, I know the future. I can read the future.” As a matter of fact, Austrian economics teaches us that we should be a little bit cautious about being totally (?) and saying, “You know, we know what the interest rates are going to be tomorrow”, we know that we can’t do that.” But we certainly can predict the trends and that gives us an upper hand on this. So what I do is I admire people like a Jimmy Rogers who knows and understands our economics and he is able to capitalize on it as well, so he can anticipate. So I think this is a victory for sound economic policy. At one time somebody asked me, “Who are you really running against? Like, is it another candidate in the Republican primary, or is it Obama or what?” I said, “No, I’m running against Keynes.” I want to make sure that we undo Nixon’s statement that we’re all Keynesians now. I hope there are less Keynesians now than there used to be.
Lew Rockwell: Ron, recently when you were campaigning in Iowa you caused a stir by quoting The Book of Samuel and talking about the prophet’s warning about would happen if there were a king instead of a pretty minimalist government of judges. And you talked about the coming dictatorship from Washington.
Ron Paul: Yea, I have always found first Samuel in Chapter 8 fascinating because Samuel was smart enough to say, “You don’t want a king” and he also recognized that a king or big government in Washington DC, replaces belief in God. So most people throughout all history believe in a creator and in a God. So who do we obey and who do we try to follow? Is it our government? Samuel said, “If you have a King, you’re going to replace the instructions you get from our creator and the things that are handed down by the fathers. So, therefore, he said don’t do it. He said before you know it, there is going to be fighting, wars, and drafting your children, girls and boys. And I thought the other thing which was pretty amazing was he said, “And they’re going to tax you also”. And I thought, “Boy, I’ll tell you, it looks like we’ve asked for a king.” We don’t call them a king, but we have dictatorial powers in Washington and they’re getting worse every single day.
Lew Rockwell: Ron, today you’re going to address a big Christian Rally in Washington. Don’t you think that even some of those people are beginning to come around?
Ron Paul: Yes, and I like to go to these functions because my language will be a little bit different, my beliefs will be a little bit different. I do have a strong faith, and I like to push them a little bit into what my understanding is from the New Testament. Growing up, being raised in a Christian Church, I was never taught that Christianity was teaching violence and war. I always thought a quite different message. And now there have been a fair number of Christians who feel this obligation on how we should treat our enemies, and that doesn’t sound anything like what Jesus taught. So I go there because it’s a challenge. But I think there is a difference. I think the reception in Iowa was diff and they are very conservative Christian people, and they’re right-to-life people. And when you’re talking about families, the response has been … you know when you talk about Israel and your family value, and that is a sound economy and people are having jobs and not having inflation all of a sudden; that’s family values too. And it’s very biblical, too, not to have dishonest money, I think we’re supposed to have honest weights and measures.
Lew Rockwell: Well, there is no question that everybody in this country is worried about the economic future. You’ve been the one man pointing out what was going to happen and what we need to do to fix things. And so I think it’s not a coincidence at all that even among people who have otherwise being Bushiets or followers of Falwell or people of that sort who do seem to almost substitute the worship of government to the worship of God, that there is this ferment, there is this new interest, and I must say it’s thrilling so Ron Paul, thank you for all you do. Thanks for the great books you write, your work in Congress, and the work you’re doing in your campaign for the presidency right this minute. I know you go to take a vote and we sure appreciate you coming on the show this morning.
Ron Paul: Thanks for having me.
Lew Rockwell: Bye bye.