In these United States of America, many people cannot afford even basic health insurance. They suffer severely under the present system and have to live under the constant fear of not knowing what they will do if they or their loved ones ever fall seriously ill.
But in many cases, insured individuals aren’t much better off either. In comparison to the exorbitant insurance premiums they pay, the medical care they receive is often very poor.
Additionally, due to the government-enforced monopolies of HMOs (Health Maintenance Organizations) and pharmaceutical companies, many patients will never even hear about some of the most effective and non-invasive treatment methods. These natural and inexpensive ways of regaining one’s health are being suppressed by the FDA and the medical establishment not because of safety concerns (they’ve been around for hundreds of years), but because they cannot be patented and would therefore cut into the pharmaceutical industry’s profits.
The current system is most definitely broken, and it must eventually be abolished if we want to regain both our health and our freedom.
But Obamacare is the worst possible answer. All it does is perpetuate a flawed system by forcing everyone to become a client of insurance companies, even those who don’t want to or need to participate.
Why should anyone be forced to subsidize the medical care of others? Very few individuals would personally assault their neighbors at gunpoint and steal thousands of dollars to pay for their own medical needs. How could any freedom loving person agree to delegate such criminal acts to the government by supporting a compulsory health insurance system?
There is only one solution that will lead to true health and true freedom: making health care more affordable. Ron Paul believes that only true free market competition will put pressure on the providers and force them to lower their costs to remain in business. Additionally, Ron Paul wants to change the tax code to allow individual Americans to fully deduct all health care costs from their taxes.
Through these measures and the elimination of government-sponsored health care monopolies a much larger number of people will be able to finally access affordable health care, either by paying for medical insurance or by covering their medical expenses, which are now much lower, out of their own pocket.
As for the poor and the severely ill who can neither obtain insurance nor pay for the medical care they need, Ron Paul offers the following solution in his book “The Revolution: A Manifesto“:
In the days before Medicare and Medicaid, the poor and elderly were admitted to hospitals at the same rate they are now, and received good care. Before those programs came into existence, every physician understood that he or she had a responsibility towards the less fortunate and free medical care was the norm. Hardly anyone is aware of this today, since it doesn’t fit into the typical, by the script story of government rescuing us from a predatory private sector.
Illegal aliens already receive de-facto free health care. Why can’t poor Americans have the same… not as a right, but as a charitable benefit provided by doctors who feel a personal responsibility for their fellow citizens?
Unfortunately, the current medical monopoly corrupts many doctors by rewarding practices that are not in the patients’ best interest. Pharmaceutical companies have a vested interest in not curing people, but getting them permanently addicted to expensive drugs that have many side effects, thereby requiring additional drugs to suppress those side effects. Many doctors are afraid to speak up and question the system for fear of being ostracized by their peers or even losing their license.
Under a liberated health care system prices would come down and additional options would become available, thereby making health care much more affordable. Moral corruption would give way to true compassion, and many doctors would remember their implicit obligation to provide free medical care to those in need, just like they did in the past.
As a medical doctor, Ron Paul swore the Hippocratic Oath many decades ago. His entire person and career is a monument to the beauty and sanctity of human life. Ron Paul knows that life without health can be very difficult and is not what it was meant to be. He has personally cared for the poor for many years, without asking anything in return.
The government’s original role is to protect our freedoms and restrain itself from causing too much harm. Ron Paul is working to prevent greedy bureaucrats, opportunist politicians and corrupt pharmaceutical companies from having any sort of unhealthy influence over our bodies and minds.
Join the Ron Paul Revolution and help us put the federal government back where it belongs: to Washington DC and out of our daily lives.
Transcript:
Government has been mismanaging medical care for more than 45 years; for every problem it has created it has responded by exponentially expanding the role of government.
Points to consider:
- No one has a right to medical care. If one assumes such a right, it endorses the notion that some individuals have a right to someone else’s life and property. This totally contradicts the principles of liberty.
- If medical care is provided by government, this can only be achieved by an authoritarian government unconcerned about the rights of the individual.
- Economic fallacies accepted for more than 100 years in the United States has deceived policy makers into believing that quality medical care can only be achieved by government force, taxation, regulations, and bowing to a system of special interests that creates a system of corporatism.
- More dollars into any monopoly run by government never increases quality but it always results in higher costs and prices.
- Government does have an important role to play in facilitating the delivery of all goods and services in an ethical and efficient manner.
- First, government should do no harm. It should get out of the way and repeal all the laws that have contributed to the mess we have.
- The costs are obviously too high but in solving this problem one cannot ignore the debasement of the currency as a major factor.
- Bureaucrats and other third parties must never be allowed to interfere in the doctor/patient relationship.
- The tax code, including the ERISA laws, must be changed to give everyone equal treatment by allowing a 100% tax credit for all medical expenses.
Laws dealing with bad outcomes and prohibiting doctors from entering into voluntary agreements with their patients must be repealed. Tort laws play a significant role in pushing costs higher, prompting unnecessary treatment and excessive testing. Patients deserve the compensation; the attorneys do not. - Insurance sales should be legalized nationally across state lines to increase competition among the insurance companies.
- Long-term insurance policies should be available to young people similar to term-life insurances that offer fixed prices for long periods of time.
- The principle of insurance should be remembered. Its purpose in a free market is to measure risk, not to be used synonymously with social welfare programs. Any program that provides for first-dollar payment is no longer insurance. This would be similar to giving coverage for gasoline and repair bills to those who buy car insurance or providing food insurance for people to go to the grocery store. Obviously, that could not work.
- The cozy relationship between organized medicine and government must be reversed.
Early on medical insurance was promoted by the medical community in order to boost re-imbursements to doctors and hospitals. That partnership has morphed into the government/insurance industry still being promoted by the current administration. - Threatening individuals with huge fines by forcing them to buy insurance is a boon to the insurance companies.
- There must be more competition for individuals entering into the medical field. Licensing strictly limits the number of individuals who can provide patient care. A lot of problems were created in 20th century as a consequence the Flexner Report (1910), which was financed by the Carnegie Foundation and strongly supported by the AMA. Many medical schools were closed and the number of doctors was drastically reduced. The motivation was to close down medical schools that catered to women, minorities and especially homeopathy. We continue to suffer from these changes which were designed to protect physician’s income and promote allopathic medicine over the more natural cures and prevention of homeopathic medicine.
- We must remove any obstacles for people seeking holistic and nutritional alternatives to current medical care. We must remove the threat of further regulations pushed by the drug companies now working worldwide to limit these alternatives.
True competition in the delivery of medical care is what is needed, not more government meddling.
Christine, Ellsworth
I spent 2 hours writing, trying to continue what I had started last night.I had succeeded in saying it in a way that I thought was coherent. Even addressed what Ellsworth asked. Unfortunately, this site said something looks like it was duplicated, and then erased everything I said. I may try later, but it was frustrating. Perhaps if I write it in a word document and paste it. Sheez
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Here is a SNL parody that reminds me of some of u.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/42025/saturday-night-live-the-view
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Extreme left / Extreme right, and you’re still stuck there.
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Actually, the government are the ants.
Our voices, the stick, in the middle of the ant hill.
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Our voices are nowhere near the ant hill.
We are more like fish, we are being drowned out.
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The government has enough to deal with besides us. They are trying to fix the biggest problem history has ever seen… overpopulation.
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That is what we are talking about dummie….
Depopulation…..Sean do want to contribute your body to the cause?
The Georgia Guidestones
Information on this monument, including text and analysis of its message, located in Elberton, Georgia.
http://www.radioliberty.com/stones.htm – Cached – Similar
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I know all about the guidestones, we just aren’t going to kill all of ourselves off. Nobody would benefit from that. There are like 10,000 books published a day, anyone can write some conspiracy literature to fool us. Seriously, if this was really going down, we wouldn’t know about it.
Population is a problem here, but it’s not a threat.. It is a threat in countries like africa where they don’t have the resources to survive.
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The guidestones were made by some Christan nut who believed from the bible that the apocalypse and the second coming of Christ was near.
When really the next precession of the equinox is near. That is what the bible refers to. It is coming sometime in the next hundred years.
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Read this…
http://www.paranormality.com/age_of_aquarius.shtml
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Age of Aquarius?
Have you finally flipped your lid? Why would we want to read something based on a belief system that grew from the idea that the sun revolved around the earth?
lmao
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A precession of an equinox is not about the sun revolving around the earth, its about the rotation of the earth, which is something that truly happens. Haven’t you heard of the movie 2012? You have never heard of the second coming of Christ? Damn you are ignorant. Educate yourself.
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And since the Guidestones have astronomical features to it, it probably has to do with the astronomy of the equinoxes and the second coming of christ as explained in the bible, about the Apocalypse… That is what is engraved in the Guildstones.. It is talking about the Apocalypse, is it not?
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You do know that religion is stories based on astronomy, don’t you?.. Moses killed everyone who was worshiping the bull or taurus. Jews blow the rams horn representing aries. 2 fishes or pisces represents jesus.
During passover supper Jesus says,
“Behold, when ye are entered into the city, there shall a man meet you, bearing a pitcher of water; follow him into the house where he entereth in.”
He is talking about the next age of Aquarius.. These mythological characters represent the ages of the equinox.
The guildstones are purely religious. It’s not some conspiracy to destroy the world.
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Even the guy who created the guidestones calls himself RC Christian.. It is purely religious.
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Sean it wasn’t Christian’s (Catholic or Protestant or Jew), who put this up, read below…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Georgia_Guidestones#Ownership
The ownership of the site is unclear. According to the Georgia Mountain Travel Association’s detailed history: “The Georgia Guidestones are located on the farm of Mildred and Wayne Mullenix…”[7] The Elbert County land registration system shows what appears to be the Guidestones as County land purchased on October 1, 1979. [8][9]
The monument was unveiled in March 1980, with the presence of 100 people.[10] Another account specifices the 22nd of March and said 400 people attended. [11]
[edit] Reactions
Yoko Ono and others have praised the inscribed messages as “a stirring call to rational thinking”, while opponents have labeled them as the “Ten Commandments of the Antichrist”.[12]
The Guidestones have become a subject of interest for conspiracy theorists. One of them, an activist named Mark Dice, a Christian conservative political activist, demanded that the Guidestones “be smashed into a million pieces, and then the rubble used for a construction project”,[13] claiming that the Guidestones are of “a deep Satanic origin,” and that R. C. Christian belongs to “a Luciferian secret society” related to the New World Order.[14] At the unveiling of the monument, a local minister proclaimed that he believed the monument was “for sun worshipers, for cult worship and for devil worship”.[10]
In 2008, the stones were defaced with polyurethane paint and graffiti with slogans such as “Death to the new world order.”[15] Wired magazine called the defacement “the first serious act of vandalism in the Guidestones’ history”.[16] The vandalism has yet to be repaired.
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God is the sun. That’s what i’m talking about.. All religions are based on astronomy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QQ-kvw1fYXs
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Sean: “God is the sun.” CORRECTION- The Son is God. The Son is Jesus. Jesus is God.
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Sean has almost scraped the bottom out of the barrel.
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Did you watch the video lindsey? Jesus is the Sun of God, or God’s sun. Jesus is a personification of the sun.
The Jesus Story is actually an allegory for what would naturally be the oldest and most important story humans would notice and write down, that of the annual passage of the seasons of the year. The position of the Sun against the celestial sphere changes during the year. This is explained below.
http://members.cox.net/deleyd/religion/solarmyth/christ2002.htm
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“They” will find themselves depopulated. You watch. Documents have just been leaked by the French government that exposes this plot to mass murder. There’s going to be an uprising over this especially in the U.S. because Obama was the top contaminated vaccine salesman to other countries. And we thought Bush destroyed our image in the world. Obama has just topped that.
Sean, you have no mind of your own. “They” control it.
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what? hippies control my mind? lol. I model everything I say after movies like the 11th hour, the crude awakening, and thousands of other documentaries that support everything I say. I too speak out against the establishment and the status quo of our country.
Watch this..
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2174195060267517042
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we will see what happens. there is no incentive for the “elite” to depopulate the earth. They feed off of our money. If we all died, their money would become worthless. They need us more than you think.
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Swine Flu: What I Believe
July 22, 2009 at 10:07 am
I believe one of the goals of the swine flu vaccine is depopulation. Perhaps it is the goal of a swine flu epidemic as well, whether bio-warfare or hype around a flu season.
read the rest of the article as to why she has known this for years…
http://solari.com/blog/?p=3532
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French documents exposing their vaccination plan with details have been leaked. These vaccines contain mercury and squaline. We all know mercury is toxic and squaline is illegal in the US and UK. Squaline is linked to the Gulf War Syndrome. Each person is responsible for doing their own research and drawing their own conclusions. There is plenty of evidence.
It follows the pattern “they” always use. Manufacture a problem that will cause a reaction of fear so we will look to “them” for the solution. Problem, reaction, solution. The solutions are always what we would not otherwise choose, but are likely to go along with if we put trust in them rather than our own selves.
Remember,
Men in caves are responsible for 911.
We are running out of oil, scarcity.
There is too much CO2 when it’s as natural as breathing.
Foreigners bombed the tube trains in Britain, always a foreign enemy to make the masses feel insecure.
Bombs here, WMDs there, paranoia reigns.
Cybersecurity is an issue, conveniently since it has been the one media we have that “they” haven’t controlled.
We only have 2 options, corp health insurance or the govt. A lie.
You know, those guidestones that display the NWO ideals…how can they ever hope to accomplish them when their minds run so counter to living ideals and peace? They only know death and destruction.
These folks who believe in the destruction strategy towards their NWO would be paranoid. They do have severe psychological problems. You best have a healthy independent mind because if you are relying on them to bring any solutions, you’ll be disappointed in the outcome.
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Oh no, another ‘peak’ theory.
Everyone sing along with sean, “Baaaaaaaaa BAAAAAAAA”
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Ah, but people did believe that the sun DID revolve around the earth for a bit…Just goes to show, there are a lot of nuts in here…er, I mean, out there.
This is all a waste of my inbox space.
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I think you are right. Probably best to spend your time @ the huffingblow post.
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Obviously you aren’t looking at the bigger picture. The government is forced to take on extra responsibilities because our population keeps doubling and doubling and resources are becoming more and more scarce.
Again, we have been in 4 different wars in the middle east since we have been running out of oil.
The population has been growing at an unbelievable rate and the numbers of doctors haven’t grown.
I think you are an ant, you are conditioned to think that population is not a grave threat. You have been too distracted with the swine flu and the federal reserve to know what is really going on.
If you don’t see this as the big picture, than you are hopeless.
http://www.paulchefurka.ca/World%20Population.JPG
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the prophecy has come true!! The dog flu is here!!!! Everyone stay in your homes and lock the doors!
http://www.myfoxillinois.com/dpp/news/dpgo_dog_flu_taking_aim_at_pets_lwf_082709_3204957
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Sean: I think that we as a country should make it easier for people to practice medicine. We should also make it easier for people to get into medical school. With an increase in the quantity of doctors we should see the cost of medicine go down as a result of supply and demand. Sean, maybe you should go to Med. school!
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Ya, I always wanted to and almost got into the field of medical research, but i’m learning business instead.
I lOOVvvve quantum mechanics. I’ve read a bad ass book and seen a ton of documentaries on it. i think it’s the cure for cancer.
You should watch this if you get some time. It will change the way you think..
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6568107389365915765&ei=1qOaSvL4FcWhlAfwk6jVAw&q=biology+of+belief+2&hl=en
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The government is not being forced to take on more. We want less government and the government keeps tying to take things over through maniuplation through covert plans of wars over resources to gain control, through our financial and legal systems, private company takeovers. All this the people do not want.
They have created the “idea of scarcity” to manipulate the masses into believing the bad that they do is actually good. You’ve fallen into their mind trap and are just where they want you…and millions of others. But others can see.
What “they” have put in place and continue to put in place creates an unhealthy population. We need “them” gone. This case of the flu will start an unraveling and an exposure of governments, politicians…everyone involved to clean house!
Of course I am focused on the mass murder of populations worldwide…and this plan is going to be twarted by people who have been and are paying attention! It is the most imminent danger to life itself worldwide…including you. If you are in support of this plan to commit mass murder, to depopulate, then that YOU will have to live with.
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No I don’t support it. I think your crazy for thinking something like this is going to happen. We will see.
If anything, the pharmicutical company made the swine flu so they could sell their vaccine and profit. That would be a realistic motive. They aren’t going to create a vaccine that kills people. Obviously it would be traced back to them and whoever is in charge would be held responsible. You have been brain washed by story writers and lost all common sense.
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You only learned of this yesterday, the day before?? and already you are an expert? News today that a government document in France was leaked and it exposed their vaccination plan.
http://www.theflucase.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=448%3Aemergency-update-leaked-french-government-document-reveals-details-of-who-forced-mass-murder-vaccination-programme-starting-september-28th-more-soon&catid=41%3Ahighlighted-news&Itemid=105&lang=en
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So.. Do you think the government is trying to wipe us out or do you think pharmeceutical companies are trying to profit by releasing the swine? It seems like Baxter would be the bad guys.
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The French are friendly peaceful people that aren’t really hurting right now. I just can’t see them or many other countries accept to kill off all of their people for some plan made by the united states. It’s just not feasible.
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Problem – Reaction – Solution
Mind control technique
They plan and orchestrate the problem (evidence this swine flu is lab-created, not natural)
The people react in fear, look to “them” for a solution, still trusting “them” (stop using their own minds)
They provide the solution, get people to do what they otherwise would not (stop using their own minds)
Research for yourself.
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Or…
Problem – Swine Flu.
Reaction – Baxter creates hundreds of millions of vaccines.
Solution – The people purchase the vaccines and Baxter becomes rich.
I don’t see the government in the equation. I just don’t think the government would kill all of their people off. I don’t see how they would benefit.
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“I don’t see…”
~Sean
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That’s a figure of speech.. I don’t see = I doubt.
Do you think what I am saying is far fetched? Do you think that all of this swine could be the work of pharmeceutical companies trying to make billions of dollars off of vaccine?
Or do you see it as armageddon? As if all of the governments collaborated a way to destroy civilization for a new world order..
Which one is more likely?
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No, I really don’t think you see the all of it.
Pharma makes money from vaccines, medications that have been prescribed for “treatment and cure” of the illnesses that stem from vaccines.
Obama et al $$ stock market. One last hoorah, a financial sweep. All 180+ countries have purchased the vaccines and tamiflu. Obama did a fine sales job, don’t you think? They put Martha Stewart in jail for insider trading. Seems Obama et al are above that law.
In the event of a pandemic, the UN can take over the country. The dream ticket for the NWO.
A swine flu video describes how China wants more space for their race. We are in debt to China. Is there a deal in the making with foreclosures? Have they found “someone” to take the “bad debt” off the bank’s books by just giving them the now empty houses, and more to come? Is this why the banks are not helping the current homeowners like they said they would be? They want the homes vacant? Is this why the bailout money went elsewhere, to buy up banks and reorganize the corporate financial structure?
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Why would obama invest in tamiflu? He will be paid for the rest of his life from being a president. Alex jones lies by the way. I’ve seen his movie about obama, im sorry if that is where you get your info.
There are deals going on with the bad debt. Banks don’t own the bad debt so they wouldn’t own the houses. The homes are being auctioned off to private investors. The bailout money was used to middle man the sale of these homes and will ALL be paid back.
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Rumsfeld is conntected with Tamiflu.
Obama is invested in the flu vaccine.
I’m sure they are not invested because they personnally “need” the money.
Not getting my info from Alex Jones.
The bad debt is still floating around and increasing with foreclosures. Still lots of foreclosures, bank owned properties. Bailout money used to buy up smaller banks, banks not lending like they used to.
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I do not have faith in government run health care.
My personal experiences or first hand knowledge brought me to that conclusion, about 40 years ago.
The Veteran’s Administration is a classic example.
While there are some V.A. hospitals that are better than others, I have seen from a very early age, how our government “takes care” of our u.s. citizens aka veteran’s.
http://my-fathers-voice.blogspot.com/
http://havestethoscopewilltravel.blogspot.com/
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Chantix Smoking Cessation Pills
In May of 2006, Pfizer received approval from the FDA to release a drug called Chantix, which was designed to chemically ‘trick’ the nicotine receptor cells in the brain to think that it was getting its ‘fix’ when in fact it was receiving a medication designed to prevent nicotine from binding with those same cells in the future. People who took Chantix were supposed to get the same temporary feeling of pleasure that they got from ingesting nicotine.
Given the reality that it was sometimes physically and psychologically impossible to persuade people to quit smoking, research and development departments at several different companies began to dedicate resources to finding a medication that would help people stop smoking and thereby save thousands of lives.
February 1, 2008 FDA issues warning and health advisory on Chantix.
The FDA has issued a warning to consumers and medical professionals about the use of Chantix indicating “It appears increasingly likely that there may be an association between Chantix and serious neuropsychiatric symptoms.”
http://www.littleeggcorntwo.com/10144/?AFID=19401&SID=
—————————————————————————————————————–
Varenicline (marketed as Chantix) Information
FDA ALERT [2/1/2008]: FDA is issuing this Alert to highlight important revisions to the WARNINGS and PRECAUTIONS sections of the full prescribing information for Chantix regarding serious neuropsychiatric symptoms. Serious neuropsychiatric symptoms have occurred in patients taking Chantix. These symptoms include changes in behavior, agitation, depressed mood, suicidal ideation, and attempted and completed suicide. While some patients may have experienced these types of symptoms and events as a result of nicotine withdrawal, some patients taking Chantix who experienced serious neuropsychiatric symptoms and events had not yet discontinued smoking. In most cases, neuropsychiatric symptoms developed during Chantix treatment, but in others, symptoms developed following withdrawal of Chantix therapy.
FDA first informed the public about the possibility of serious neuropsychiatric symptoms in the November 20, 2007 FDA Early Communication About an Ongoing Safety Review. At that time, information about serious neuropsychiatric symptoms in patients taking Chantix was added to the POST-MARKETING EXPERIENCE section of the prescribing information. As FDA’s review of the issue has progressed, it appears increasingly likely that there is an association between Chantix and serious neuropsychiatric symptoms. As a result, FDA requested that Pfizer, the manufacturer of Chantix, elevate the prominence of this safety information to the WARNINGS and PRECAUTIONS sections of the Chantix prescribing information. In addition, FDA is working with Pfizer to finalize a Medication Guide for patients.
http://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DrugSafety/PostmarketDrugSafetyInformationforPatientsandProviders/ucm106540.htm
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Ellsworth:
Since you have all the answers, I’d like you to please dictate to us what the absolutist’s moral evaluation of this situation is:
I think that we can all agree, even without resort to some ancient religious tome, whatever the source, that it is wrong, immoral, illegal, to take a life. Simple, no question about that. Or is it quite so simple?
We agree that it is justified to take a life in self-defense. We can also agree that taking a life is justified when a community, a state, a nation takes up arms in defense of its homeland against the assault of an invading army. Thus, now we have exceptions to the absolutist assertion that the taking of a life is wrong.
But suppose someone walks into a church attended by another person and kills him in the sanctity of that church while the shooting victim is acting as an usher and handing out newsletters to the church followers. The killer says that he killed the man standing in his own church because he was an abortionist. Is the killing justified? The killer says he shot the abortionist in defense of third persons, namely the future fetuses whose inchoate existences the abortionist would terminate. Simple conclusion that the killing was wrong? That the killing was justified? Which side are you on?
Now, say a cell of 19 “patriots” hijacks some airplanes and flies them into some buildings causing the deaths of in excess of 3,000 people and property destruction in the billions. Were those killings justified? Most would answer that not only were the killings not justified, they were heinous. But the hijackers leave evidence that the reason they did what they did was to defend their countrymen against what they perceived was the threat of future deaths caused by the imperial power’s armed forces invading them to steal their resources. The hijackers believed that the damage they inflicted upon the imperial power would bring its economic system down and destroy its society. Who is right? Who is wrong in that situation? I think we know where you stand on that one, Ellsworth. But, what about the perspective and justification of the hijackers?
Now, let’s say a country inflicts the deaths of hundreds of thousands when it chooses to invade another country to find and destroy weapons of mass destruction that it believes threaten the population of the invading country. However, it turns out that the invading country was mistaken about the existence of the weapons of mass destruction. Were the killings of the hundreds of thousands justified? Were they wrong, immoral, illegal? Can the invading country hide behind the “shit happens” defense?
You see Ellsworth, the answers to questions of what is right and what is wrong are not always easy to arrive at. However, where you have me wrong is concluding that I am a relativist, that I do not believe in right and wrong and that I believe only in situational relative ethics. I strongly and deeply believe in what is right and wrong.
Your problem is that you believe that you have a monopoly on knowing the right and wrong. And, by falling prey to your self-inflated belief that you have a monopoly on right and wrong, you ultimately find yourself engaging in situational ethics, maybe more often than not. I believe in making sure that before one makes snap judgments about right and wrong, that one should make sure that he or she gathers as much in the way of facts that can be gathered before the judgment is made.
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Peter,
Here’s one answer for yah from Congress;prevent any further abuses of executive branch power. From 911 was war justified? Was torture justified? President Bush’s brother was in charge of Security for the Towers and Dulles airport….no indictment of his brother either.
from Library of Congress
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c111:30:./temp/~c111DQzdHT::
Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives that President Barack Obama should immediately work to reverse damaging and illegal actions taken by the Bush/Cheney Administration… (Introduced in House)
HRES 417 IH
111th CONGRESS
1st Session
H. RES. 417
Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives that President Barack Obama should immediately work to reverse damaging and illegal actions taken by the Bush/Cheney Administration and collaborate with Congress to proactively prevent any further abuses of executive branch power.
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
May 7, 2009
Ms. BALDWIN submitted the following resolution; which was referred to the Committee on the Judiciary, and in addition to the Committees on Armed Services, Foreign Affairs, and Select Intelligence (Permanent Select), for a period to be subsequently determined by the Speaker, in each case for consideration of such provisions as fall within the jurisdiction of the committee concerned
RESOLUTION
Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives that President Barack Obama should immediately work to reverse damaging and illegal actions taken by the Bush/Cheney Administration and collaborate with Congress to proactively prevent any further abuses of executive branch power.
Whereas over the past several years, serious questions have been raised about the conduct of high ranking Bush/Cheney Administration officials in relation to some of the most basic elements of our democracy: respect for the rule of law, the principle of checks and balances, and the fundamental freedoms enshrined in the Bill of Rights;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration misled the American public and the U.S. Congress regarding the threat of Iraqi weapons of mass destruction and alleged, despite all evidence to the contrary, a relationship between Iraq and al Qaeda, and this deceit dragged our country into a preemptive and unjustified war that has taken the lives of more than 4,000 U.S. troops, injured 30,000 more, and will cost our Nation more than a trillion dollars;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration undermined national security by manipulating and exaggerating evidence of Iran’s nuclear weapons capabilities despite no real evidence that Iran had the intention or capability of attacking the U.S., and then deliberately downplayed the December 2007 National Intelligence Estimate that reported with `high confidence’ that Iran stopped developing nuclear weapons in 2003 because of international pressure;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration undertook a broad assault on civil liberties through the suspension of habeas corpus and claiming the power to declare any person an `enemy combatant,’ blatantly ignoring the Geneva Convention protections that the U.S. helped create, ratify, and which carry the weight of law;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration endorsed the torture and rendition of prisoners in violation of stated American policy and values, as well as international law, and then destroyed videotapes which may have substantiated such torture;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration violated the Fourth Amendment and the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act of 1978 by spying on Americans without a court order or oversight;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration abused the state secrets privilege in recent legal challenges regarding warrantless wiretapping, torture, and rendition, and this administration’s use of the state secrets privilege was to the detriment of the rights of private litigants harmed by egregious misconduct, as well as Americans’ trust in the judicial system;
Whereas Bush/Cheney Administration officials consistently impeded congressional investigations into allegations of wrongdoing by refusing to comply with congressional subpoenas;
Whereas the Bush/Cheney Administration claims that then-senior presidential advisers were immune from congressional subpoenas impeded congressional oversight, undermined the rule of law, damaged our democracy, and were rejected by a U.S. District Court;
Whereas U.S. Attorneys pursued politically motivated prosecutions in violation of the law, and allegedly at the direction of the Bush/Cheney Administration;
Whereas Bush/Cheney Administration officials in the Department of Justice systematically violated the law and committed misconduct in basing hiring decisions for career prosecutor positions, detailees to senior Department offices, and immigration judgeships on the applicants’ political affiliations and view;
Whereas it appears Bush/Cheney Administration officials intentionally revealed the identity of Valerie Plame Wilson as a covert agent of the CIA for political retribution, and then intentionally obstructed justice by disseminating false information through the White House press office;
Whereas President Bush showed contempt for the legislative branch and disregard for the law through the excessive expansion of presidential power in misusing signing statements that declared his intent to ignore provisions of legislation he signed into law;
Whereas Bush/Cheney Administration officials systematically shielded from access and destroyed public documents relevant to the conduct of the Administration by utilizing non-governmental e-mail accounts for official communications;
Whereas Vice President Cheney consistently placed self-interest over serving the American people, exemplified by his claim that the Office of the Vice President is not an entity within the executive branch for the alleged purpose of shielding the activities of his office from public scrutiny;
Whereas President Bush, Vice President Cheney, and other Bush/Cheney Administration officials were presented with ample opportunities to collaborate with Congress and reverse the above listed damaging and abusive actions;
Whereas despite these opportunities, they instead chose to show contempt for the Constitution and the legislative branch, compelling Americans and Congress to look to the next administration for executive branch accountability;
Whereas, on November 4, 2008, Americans elected President of the United States Barack Obama;
Whereas, on January 20, 2009, President Obama stood before the American people and took an oath of office, swearing to `. . . preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States’;
Whereas this commitment and obligation is so fundamental to our democracy that our Nation’s founders proscribed this oath in our Constitution;
Whereas no President or Congress has the authority to override that document, whereby `We the People’ conferred upon the branches of government limited and defined power, and provided for meaningful checks and balances;
Whereas the actions taken by President Obama will impact the conduct of future Presidents, perhaps for generations;
Whereas President Obama has already begun work to reaffirm American values of justice and freedom;
Whereas President Obama issued a January 22, 2009, executive order requiring that Guantanamo Bay detention facility be closed within one year and that until its closure, conditions of confinement at Guantanamo must comply with Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions and all other applicable laws;
Whereas President Obama issued a January 22, 2009, executive order to promote the safe, lawful, and humane treatment of individuals in United States custody by prohibiting any interrogation technique or approach, or any treatment related to interrogation, that is not authorized by and listed in Army Field Manual, and reaffirms that all terrorist suspects held by the United States abroad are protected under Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions;
Whereas President Obama issued a January 22, 2009, executive order to establish a Special Task Force on Detainee Disposition to thoroughly review detention policy options and provide a report to the President within 6 months;
Whereas President Obama stated in his February 24, 2009, remarks to the Joint Session of Congress, `without exception or equivocation that the United States of America does not torture’;
Whereas President Obama issued a March 9, 2009, Memorandum for the Heads of Executive Departments and Agencies on Presidential Signing Statements to clarify his intention to issue signing statements `to address constitutional concerns only when it is appropriate to do so as a means of discharging my constitutional responsibilities’ and to outline steps to promote greater transparency and accountability in issuing signing statements;
Whereas President Obama’s efforts to renew America must include restoring executive branch accountability through proactively preventing future abuses of power by his or future administrations; and
Whereas the actions detailed below may assist in his work to restore the public’s faith in our Government: Now, therefore, be it
Resolved, That it is the sense of the House of Representatives that President Obama should take the necessary steps to do the following–
(1) AFFIRM OUR NATION’S COMMITMENT TO UPHOLDING THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES- President Obama must immediately and publicly reaffirm our Nation’s commitment to the rule of law, the principle of checks and balances, respect for the legislative process, and the fundamental freedoms enshrined in the Bill of Rights.
(2) FULLY INVESTIGATE BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS’ ALLEGED CRIMES AND HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE FOR ANY ILLEGAL ACTS- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional oversight efforts to establish an independent investigation, as well as to address potential statute of limitation concerns, in order to hold all Bush/Cheney Administration officials accountable for any crimes they may have committed.
(3) HOLD ACCOUNTABLE BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS WHO SHOWED OR SHOW CONTEMPT FOR THE LEGAL DUTY TO COMPLY WITH CONGRESSIONAL SUBPOENAS- President Obama must fully support Congress’ constitutionally rooted right of access to the information it needs to perform its legislative and oversight functions enunciated in Article I of the Constitution.
(4) HOLD ACCOUNTABLE BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS WHO DISCLOSED THE IDENTITY OF ANY COVERT INTELLIGENCE AGENT- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to ensure that the disclosure of the identity of any United States intelligence agent could give rise to criminal liability.
(5) HOLD ACCOUNTABLE BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION OFFICIALS WHO PURSUED POLITICALLY MOTIVATED PROSECUTIONS- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to restore faith in the American justice system by investigating and censuring any officials who engage in misconduct in Federal office.
(6) ENSURE THAT ANY BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION OFFICIAL GUILTY OF A WAR CRIME IS PROSECUTED UNDER THE WAR CRIMES ACT AND THE ANTI-TORTURE ACT- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to repeal the redefinition of grave abuses of Common Article 3 of the Geneva Conventions included in the Military Commissions Act of 2006, which limits the scope of the original War Crimes Act and makes this repeal retroactively operable to the beginning of the invasion of Iraq. President Obama must also cooperate fully with congressional investigations into the lack of prosecutions under the War Crimes Act and the Federal Anti-Torture Act despite countless allegations of serious violations.
(7) AFFIRM THAT IT IS THE SOLE LEGAL RIGHT OF CONGRESS TO DECLARE WAR- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to tighten the standards for when a declaration of war is required for military action.
(8) CRIMINALIZE LYING TO CONGRESS AND THE AMERICAN PUBLIC ABOUT THE REASONS FOR GOING TO WAR- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to strengthen Federal perjury laws to prohibit the issuance of false statements, concealment, or false documentation in any matter related to a presidential request for a declaration of war.
(9) RESTORE THE WRIT OF HABEAS CORPUS AS AN ESSENTIAL PRINCIPLE OF OUR DEMOCRACY- President Obama must reaffirm our Nation’s treaty obligations under the Geneva Conventions and ensure all individuals held by the United States have access to the courts to petition for a writ of habeas corpus.
(10) ENSURE TORTURE IS UNIFORMLY PROHIBITED UNDER UNITED STATES LAW- While recognizing that President Obama has taken important steps in asserting his position that torture is antithetical to American values, he must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to codify strong anti-torture language and approve uniform standards for interrogation techniques applicable to individuals under control or custody of the United States Government.
(11) ENSURE RENDITION IS UNIFORMLY PROHIBITED UNDER UNITED STATES LAW- President Obama must cooperate fully with congressional efforts to outlaw torture `outsourcing’ by prohibiting the direct or indirect transfer or return of persons by the U.S. for the purpose of detention, interrogation, trial, or otherwise to a country listed by the Secretary of State as supporting torture, cruel, or degrading treatment used in detention or interrogation of individuals.
(12) RESPONSIBLY CLOSE THE GUANTANAMO BAY DETENTION CAMP- While President Obama has boldly declared his intention to close Guantanamo by January 2010, he must do everything in his power to ensure that all suspected terrorists held at Guantanamo are immediately tried in fair judicial proceedings and are not subjected to trial by secret evidence. He must also engage the international community to swiftly ensure the release of innocent detainees, including the Chinese Uighurs.
(13) ENSURE THAT AMERICANS CAN BRING CLAIMS AGAINST THEIR GOVERNMENT- President Obama must guarantee that the state secrets privilege shall not constitute grounds for dismissal of a case or claim and instead require independent judicial review of claims of state secrets privilege by executive branch officials.
(14) IMMEDIATELY TAKE AFFIRMATIVE STEPS TO PROTECT ALL BUSH/CHENEY ADMINISTRATION DOCUMENTS- President Obama must publicly reaffirm that the Office of the Vice President is part of the executive branch.
(15) PUBLICLY REVIEW POTENTIAL ABUSES OF THE PRESIDENTIAL PARDON PROCESS- President Obama must collaborate fully with Congress to investigate the granting of presidential pardons and articulate comprehensive standards to guide future presidential pardons.
(16) FURTHER REFORM THE USE OF PRESIDENTIAL SIGNING STATEMENTS- While President Obama has affirmed his intention to issue signing statements sparingly and with a high degree of transparency, he must commit to providing all signing statements for publication, affirm Congress’ right to participate in court proceedings regarding the constitutionality of any presidential signing statements, and ensure that Congress can obtain testimony from administration officials who may attempt to claim executive privilege to explain or justify any signing statements.
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Dearest Peter,
I intended to read all of your post.
However, when you are unable to be honest so early in the post it causes all reasoning folk to move on to the next post.
Quoting you:
“I think that we can all agree, even without resort to some ancient religious tome, whatever the source, that it is wrong, immoral, illegal, to take a life. Simple, no question about that. Or is it quite so simple?”
Leaving behind the fact that your response is both condescending and divisive, it simply is not factual. Murder is the immoral act. All taking of life is not murder.
Defense is the word that you don’t want to say.
If you cannot be both personally honest, and intellectually honest, on this site then you will just end up being our next sean. That might be something that you aspire to, but is it worth all of the cleat marks?
Who knows, maybe in the remainder of your post you actually redeemed yourself…. But who could choke down the beginning?
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Okay, Peter, I take it back, maybe you are a wingnut. Congratulations and welcome!
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There you go again, Ellsworth. Passing judgment, labeling, namecalling.
You really must have all the answers. I therefore sit at your feet and await your latest pronouncement of the “truth.”
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Let me think, Peter.
Here’s one: Stop thinking that “passing judgement” is a bad thing. Develop a value system of your own, and, by all means, judge your experiences against that system. Make corrections to your system as you discover mistakes. Re-examine your premises if you discover contradictions in your judgments.
The intellectuals who condemn “judgement” are not singling out persons with irrational value systems (like racists and mystics)–almost no one pays attention to these morons anyway. The intellectuals who want you to believe “passing judgment” is contemptible secretly oppose value systems of all kinds. They are the “relativists” I spoke of. The process of integrating facts and experience, of thinking, and believing you live in a world of knowable, objective facts makes you difficult to control.
Therefore, I command that you no longer use the term “passing judgement”. (However, I will still fight the government from stopping you from saying whatever you please.)
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from…The Library of Congress-Thomas
key in Mandatory Swine Flu Vaccine
Here’s just one…….
No Child Left Unimmunized Against Influenza Act of 2009 (Introduced in House)
HR 2596 IH
111th CONGRESS
1st Session
H. R. 2596
To authorize the Secretary of Health and Human Services to carry out a demonstration program to test the feasibility of using the Nation’s elementary and secondary schools as influenza vaccination centers.
The enemy………
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
May 21, 2009
Mr. GENE GREEN of Texas (for himself and Mr. TIM MURPHY of Pennsylvania) introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on Energy and Commerce, and in addition to the Committee on Education and Labor, for a period to be subsequently determined by the Speaker, in each case for consideration of such provisions as fall within the jurisdiction of the committee concerned
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/thomas
Parental Right to Decide Protection Act (Introduced in House)
HR 3188 IH
111th CONGRESS
1st Session
H. R. 3188
To prohibit Federal funding or other assistance for mandatory human papillomavirus (HPV) vaccination programs.
IN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES
July 13, 2009
Mr. GINGREY of Georgia (for himself, Mrs. BLACKBURN, Mr. LATTA, Mr. MARCHANT, Mr. AKIN, Mr. BARTLETT, Mr. PITTS, Mr. BARRETT of South Carolina, Mr. PENCE, Mr. POSEY, Mr. HENSARLING, and Mr. BRADY of Texas) introduced the following bill; which was referred to the Committee on Energy and Commerce
(8) With a number of states entertaining legislation which takes the unprecedented step in requiring young girls to obtain a vaccine for a disease that is not spread by casual contact in order to attend school, many organizations and associations have come out against mandatory HPV vaccine programs.
(9) The American College of Pediatricians and the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons are opposed to any legislation which would require HPV vaccination for school attendance. They have stated that excluding children from school for refusal to be vaccinated for a disease spread only by intercourse is a serious, precedent-setting action that trespasses on the right of parents to make medical decisions for their children as well as on the rights of the children to attend school.
(10) Federal funds should not be used to implement a mandatory vaccine program for a disease that does not threaten the public health of schoolchildren in the course of casual, daily interaction between classmates and inserts the government into the lives of children, parents, and physicians.
SEC. 3. PROHIBITION AGAINST FUNDING FOR MANDATORY HUMAN PAPILLOMAVIRUS (HPV) VACCINATION PROGRAMS.
No Federal funds or other assistance may be made available to any State or political subdivision of a State to establish or implement any requirement that individuals receive vaccination for human papillomavirus (HPV).
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c111:9:./temp/~c111DDrasR::
footnote: 47 deaths so far from Gardisil vaccination!
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wait…why is the NWO trying to kill humans again? I am not sure I understand.
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They are infested with them.
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Real US unemployment rate at 16 percent: Fed official
Aug 26 02:25 PM US/Eastern
Payroll employment has fallen by 6.7 million since the recession began.
read more: http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=CNG.4452bed82adf3124e5884678e236d7fb.361&show_article=1
———————————————————————–
No President should be able to appoint CZARS without congressional consent. President Obama has appointed 57. Paid by the taxpayers.
John Holdren, Obama’s Science Czar, says: Forced abortions and mass sterilization needed to save the planet !
read more…..http://zombietime.com/john_holdren/
quotes from his book: Ecoscience Population-Resources-Environment
authors Paul R. Erlich, Anne H.Erlich, John P. Holdren
PagePage 944: As of 1977, we are facing a global overpopulation catastrophe that must be resolved at all costs by the year 2000
Book he authored in 1977 advocates for extreme totalitarian measures to control the population
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I like you Ellsworth….thanks for telling Peter, he’s the confused one not us! LOL
Here’s another favorite of mine….watch his latest video….
IN fact in this video..he says..something I said weeks ago in here,
We watch, we see we know……that is how we know reality….
Salbuchi – We, The People Fighting You, One-Worldlers…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9Veie-IZVQ
1/2 Salbuchi – We, The People *The Insurrection*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ln-0EqbiKZM&feature=related
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I chuckle when leftists like Peter resort to calling us “authoritarians” and “fascists” and the like. Do they even read what we write? Where liberty for us is simply living our lives free from government coercion, their definition is government controlling our lives in ways *they* agree with (for the benefit of all of us, of course!) They so hate and distrust humankind, I wonder how they will ever find the saints they expect to control us.
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Ellsworth:
How the hell do you know what I believe? It is so typical of the authoritarian personality to throw out generalizations about minorities and others who hold contrary political beliefs. You don’t know crap about what I believe.
I’ll tell you what I believe. Here it is:
Jesus + 0 = X.
Put that in your pipe and smoke it, Ellsworth.
Now tell me what I believe Mr. Authoritarian. And, while you’re at it, tell me what to eat, what to drink, how to dress, what to think, what to say, what not to say. Tell me, Mr. Authoritarian, because you have all the answers and I don’t. Who ordained you with a monopoly on knowing everything? Oh, I know. God did. Lucky you. Unlucky me.
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Wow, the anger is thick in your words.
Why are anti-theists so angry?
Is it that ‘I came from nothing’ thing?
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Well…..this site has it all….amazing! Is it true however?
Total Reality 2012
http://www.myspace.com/totalreality2012
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Watch Vaccine Shot Ingredients:
http://www.videosurf.com/video/vaccine-shot-ingredient-abortion-67538427?vlt=kosmix
Watch MUST SEE! H1N1 Swine Flu Vaccine
http://www.videosurf.com/video/must-see-h1n1-swine-flu-vaccines-will-be-used-for-depopulation-and-martial-law-part-1-74781981
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Study: Candle-lit dinners add to pollution
By Jennifer Harper (Contact)
Originally published 02:27 p.m., August 19, 2009, updated 04:33 p.m., August 19, 2009
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/aug/19/study-candle-lit-dinners-emit-pollution/?feat=article_top10_read
“I’ve known this for @ 20 years….beeswax or soybean candles do not emit air pollution. Read it in “Hulda Clark,biochemist’s book,the Cure for all Diseases. Lots of good info in her books!
Of course the government has deported her, for her wisdom.
Government doesn’t want any cures for diseases….no profit in it as the Veterinarians have told me.
Study: Mercury in fish is widespread
By Dina Cappiello ASSOCIATED PRES
Originally published 02:12 p.m., August 19, 2009, updated 02:13 p.m., August 19, 2009
http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2009/aug/19/study-mercury-fish-widespread/
Mercury can damage the nervous system and cause learning disabilities in developing fetuses and young children. The main source of mercury to most of the streams tested, according to the researchers, is emissions from coal-fired power plants. The mercury released from smokestacks rains down into waterways, where natural processes convert it into methylmercury — a form that allows the toxin to wind its way up the food chain into fish.
” Of course we have known this for years too…its especially in the Great Lakes. And I have had all my mercury/amalgam fillings removed from my teeth, 30 years ago. Which helped me tremendously! I find it Ironic however as we all do that our government is spending so much money on the “water project”, but continue to preserve all Vaccines with thimerosal. Which is caused a decrease in children s I.Q. for life….
However, this year they replaced it with Aluminum and even more toxic to the brain.
( I wonder why they don’t put Colloidal Silver in the vaccines if they insist on putting any metals at all in them!)
Mercury In Vaccines Was Replaced With Something Even MORE Toxic
Jan 27, 2009 … If a vaccine is mercury-free, does that really mean it’s safe?
articles.mercola.com/…/mercury-in-vaccines-was-replaced-with-something-even-more-toxic.aspx – Cached -
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I think Sergio, one of the major reasons for the high cost of all of the above is, insurance. Dr’s, nurses and medical personell have to carry “malpractice” insurance. This is and can be very cumbersome on us. It used to be just the doctors but then the doctors started shifting the blame on the nurses or others, if something went wrong, so nurses are more accountable for making sure the doctor doesn’t screw up, ie; leaving instruments in bodies etc…it does make everyone more aware, but because of lawsuits, health professional have to pay more for insurance, which means they have to charge more to patients and on and on.
poop rolls down hill.
No one hear at all denies that our country needs to have reform, but we also need to cut off/ cap those lawyers that make a fortune off of the misfortunes of others, ie; tort reform.
They really go hand in hand and if we can get the politicians to work across the isle with each other and address this and do something about, without worrying that their pocket books will be affected when they cut off the lobbyist, we can see change.
I know the majority of Americans want this mess cleaned up.
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We will never settle the healthcare debate while a large number of Americans believe that healthcare is some kind of “right”. How can anything that someone else must provide be a right? You have a right to your life, but do you have a right to force someone to make you well, a right to force a drug company to make medicine, or a right to force an insurance company to pay your bills? People believe the stupidest things and politicians will always cater to them, and neither has any concern for the consequences. This is where we are now.
The only reform we need in healthcare is to get government out of it–completely. Having been involved in healthcare and insurance for many years, I can say I have never seen an industry that is as regulated and coerced as this one is. Every time the government makes us do something stupid, I assure you we pass those costs to you. Each and every regulation the people demand drives the physician and the patient farther apart. Asking the government to step in and fix things is like inviting Hitler over to chase away Nazis.
If anyone reading this honestly believes healthcare costs are high because doctors and insurance companies are incompetent and greedy, then I am sure you have never worked in healthcare. Instead, like most people hoping for a government takeover, you have been duped by the very people causing the problems.
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Why is health care not a right, but private property is a right? What is your authority for asserting that private property is a right, Mr. Knowitall? Where is the mathematical proof that private property is a right? Where is the mathematical proof that health care is not? Is private property a right because it’s in your Bible, Mr. Smartypants? C’mon now. Trot out your good book and cherrypick the passage that allows you to assert that private property is a right but health care is not.
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No one has a “right” to healthcare. No one can have a right to anything that someone else must provide. I have a right to complain about the government, but I have no right to a printing press or a copier or a computer (because someone else must make these things). I have a right to worship, to defend myself, to “own” private property, but no one is obliged to give me a church, a gun, or a parcel of land. In the same way, a person who believes he has a “right” to healthcare necessarily believes a doctor has *no* right to choose his patients, or set his rates, or decide which medicines he will prescribe, which procedures he will perform, or how he will administer his practice. Consequently, that person must also believe the owner of an insurance company has no right to decide to whom he will sell policies, which procedures and medicines he will cover, or how much he will charge. The person who believes he has a “right” to healthcare–or any good or service produced by someone else–differs only in degrees but not fundamentally from the slave-owner (and is no better).
Therefore, a “right” is simply man’s right to his life. From that he possesses the right to act in ways that do not violate the right of others. When government protects this fundamental “right” and its corollaries, the citizens are “free”.
So why does freedom work so well for other markets, but seem to fail for healthcare? Answer: The health industry is hardly free: it is over-regulated and over-governed. Government interference, by way of mandates and regulations, circumvent the Law of Supply and Demand, which creates monopolies, drives up costs, and degenerates medical practice. One need only look inside a typical American hospital and compare the number of administrators and clinicians to patients. How many hours are spent and positions exist solely to fulfill some government-mandated function?
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Corporations have polluted the air, the water and the employees….I have taken care of many of GM’s workers and other factory workers in Michigan….
No doctor would claim their condition was due to exposure to e.g Benzene, car paint with arsenic, Mercury lighting..and standing in solvents, and oil and PCP’s.
Factories have dumped all kinds of metals and petroleum products down the sewage drains, into lakes, into the ocean, into the rivers……
Corporations now expect government to take care of their sick and diseased….
While Corporations “Skip Town/Country”……
I am not so sure that that is real reason they left the country…they had created so much illness in this country by polluting it, that they left to go pollute another country and foreigners…….! That’s a different twist isn’t it?
So, the government is complying cuz afterall they make the policies for corporations and they are the ones who allowed it, all these years..just like they are doing with GMO Seeds,Gardesil,36 Children’s Vaccinations loaded with live virus’s and metals and animal DNA, Fluoride in the water,chemtrails of Barium and Aluminium.
And the beat goes on……………
People you have to become aware of all kinds of things, that those in power do not have the time to think about or read about. They are ingrained into the system…even the doctors are…they don’t think out of the box.
They don’t like to admit mistakes and don’t like to ask for direction….Certainly not all of them, of course.
But, its very difficult to figure out who is Aware and Alert. Because, they have to conform to the status quo while in office.
Many Senators and Representatives are not awake, they live in denial and refuse to report their buddies….they have huge Ego’s…
They allowed their brains to be saturated from Harvard or Yale. or the War College, with an enormous amount of information, what I call the wrong information.
Most of all they are either afraid or can not “THINK for Themselves”.
Knowledge is good. But its being able to put the pieces of the puzzle together and see the entire picture.
Without knowledge people perish! As a man thinketh so is he.
It just is not a perfect government and we are not a perfect people….
I love learning about anything that might be truth, that I can become aware of and apply it to my own life…
If we would all have an attitude of not harming ourselves and not harming another, we would all live in peace.
If there is evidence that I am going to be harmed by taking the Flu Vaccine. That does not make me paranoid.
If that were the case, then why would government make laws against drugs and cigarettes…are they paranoid because they know it can cause them harm?
Facts are facts.
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It makes me smart not to take the vaccine…..it does not make me rebellious, the facts are the facts
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I’D LIKE THOUGHTS FROM BOTH SIDES OF THIS ARGUMENT:
I have a couple of questions (and no, I am not being sarcastic). If we, as a country, decide to go with the free market plan of getting rid of the insurance companies and middle men, then:
1. How can we expect the doctors to agree to lower fees than they are receiving now? Or is it that the insurance companies force rates to go through the roof and the doctors get paid a nominal fee anyway? I don’t think this is true, especially since the doctors of several generations ago were not in the business to get rich. It seems to me that today’s doctors are driving expensive cars and have several homes…(nothing wrong with that, but just part of my question)
2. What happens to all of the companies that make the equipment and materials that doctors need to do their job at the level they are doing it now? If the doctors make a more affordable rate, don’t all of their material costs and overhead have to come down in price too? including rent, employee salaries and travel costs? (Will gas prices drop too?)
3. Will the millions of factory workers who manufacture all the components of all the medical equipment used by all of the doctors and hospitals in this country be forced to accept even lower wages than they currently receive?
Sounds like socialism to me (OK, THAT was sarcasm).
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ANSWERS:
1. How do we make doctors’ lower their fees? Option 1: Demand government set prices. This will gradually (among other repercussions) drive away talent. Smart people will ask themselves why they should work so hard for the same money public school janitors make. Instead they will go into more lucrative professions. If you doubt this prediction, gauge the overall talent of the clinicians and staff at a typical Medicaid clinic where prices are fixed. Option 2: Let the free market work. If doctors are getting rich, you can bet there are plenty of people who want to get in on that action. Some will be very good, others will not. Let the customer (i.e., the patients and their families)–not the government and the AMA union–decide who can practice and who can’t and who stays in business and who doesn’t. The Law of Supply & Demand–as it ALWAYS does–will adjust prices to a level people can afford.
2. How do we make equipment and medicine cheaper? Same as above, let the free market work. LASIK is an excellent example of a once very expensive technology that is now very affordable. (It’s not the only one, but people know about it because so many of us have eye problems.) The price reduction happened for two primary reasons: Government did not subsidize it and (most) insurance companies didn’t pay for it. First, when government pays the practice for the equipment (and/or pays for the procedures in which the equipment is used), the manufacturer has absolutely no incentive to lower the price or to make his business more efficient so he *can* lower the price. It is often cheaper to spend money lobbying Congress than making improvements to the manufacturing process–it is certainly always less risky. Second, insurance companies are so entangled in government that it is impossible for them to innovate. Government stifles competition (i.e., the free market) with regulation and protectionism, keeping stagnant insurance companies in business (and new ones out), which diminishes consumer choice. (I can hardly feel sorry for the insurance companies since they intentionally chose to get into bed with government to protect themselves [and their huge profits] from competition.)
3. Will factory workers accept lower wages? Option 1: Encourage the government to create minimum wages, which will drive up costs and reduce the purchasing power of the dollar. When the factory eventually fails, demand a government take-over (to produce goods that no one wanted or at a price no one wanted to pay). Option 2: Again, let the free market work. As long as government is not setting prices, people will go where they can earn the most money, utilizing the skills they have. For example, if a domestic company can manufacture MRI machines cheaper overseas, paying workers considerably less than the artificial minimum wage at home, this benefits EVERYONE. First, it benefits the foreign worker, who is likely making more than he could anywhere else (unless he lives in a leftist, socialist country, that forces him to work where it chooses). Second, it benefits our worker because he must work somewhere else where his skills are needed (rather than making MRI machines, which he can’t do as cheaply as the foreign worker). Additionally, moving abroad encourages our workers to develop new skills. (Stagnation, think communism. Dynamic change, think free market.) Third, it benefits the whole economy, which means it benefits you and me! Like LASIK, MRI machines are cheaper.
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1. How many people living in the middle and lower classes will suffer while the “free” market works itself out? Sounds like a great way to get those pesky immigrants out of the country quick…alterior motive, anyone?
2. I don’t think government intervention and involvement is the answer, but I also do not think it is the core of the problem. At least, not directly. I believe greed beats all, and ultimately, the doctors will form their own groups (governments?) to edge out the competition and keep prices as high as possible for as long as possible. You cannot rule out human nature when you are arguing for the betterment of humanity.
3. If skills and the will to work in the best possible place were all we needed, then, man, I would not be working the job I have today. See, the problem here again is that you do not consider the human being behind your arguments. You assume that all involved in a free system will follow rules, pay fairly, allow for trade and free competition openly, and work as hard as possible to maintain quality in order to keep their business running. THERE IS STAGNATION ALREADY in the free market we have.
And by the way, when a worker here loses his/her job to an overseas move, I guarantee they don’t see the situation as an opportunity or a benefit that allows him to get that job he/she really wants and deserves.
It’s easy to figure all of this out when you don’t live in the shoes of the “people” you are pretending to care about and who don’t have the luxuries you and I enjoy.
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1. I imagine the poor will suffer as they always do when markets are free (i.e., when people are free to trade voluntarily with one another for goods and services they value)…they won’t! In fact, I expect the middle-class to expand, and the standard of living for everyone to rise–dramatically–as it always has historically when markets are free.
2. I don’t doubt that doctors and everyone else want to live their lives comfortably in different and sometimes–from my point of view, based on my own personal values–extravagant ways. Are they greedy? Does it matter?
Charlie and his cohorts can join forces and try to fix the price of bananas, but, fortunately, Charlie can’t put a gun to our heads and make us buy them, at least not in a free market. (Only government has the legal monopoly on the use of force.) Nor in a free market can Charlie stop competitors, who want in on the banana action, from undercutting his prices to gain market share. Nor can he stop his competitors’ competitors, who will undercut theirs. And most importantly Charlie is powerless to thwart the Law of Supply & Demand: As prices get too high, people switch to oranges. So as Charlie would prefer to charge the world $150 per banana and become a trillionaire, somehow it doesn’t work out for him. (And if you disagree with my point, I have some silver mines you might want to buy.)
Healthcare, as a means for doctors and everyone else involved to earn a living, is absolutely no different from any other type of business, and capitalism (even spooky *greedy* capitalism) will work if you let it. The problem is government gets in the way. Consider: Charlie convinces Congress that without his fine company the nation won’t have bananas. (A banana crisis!) Further, he convinces them that his competitors can’t be trusted and are selling poison bananas (or something equally absurd). Since the government believes consumers are too stupid to choose good bananas over poisoned ones (and the Ralph Naders agree), they effect new rules and regulations to protect the helpless dolts–regulations with which Charlie’s big company is prepared to comply (since he helped draft them), but are (surprise!) cost-prohibitive for start-ups (Charlie’s future competitors).
Leftists believe the villain is Charlie. Rightists don’t particularly like Charlie either (despite what you may have heard since we’re usually accused of blindly supporting big business everywhere), but we believe the problem is with *government*. Here’s why we’re right: There are a million Charlies out there. Most of them are not evil and their demands are not suspect and probably well-intentioned. Charlie may truly have a thing for bananas, and he may believe that he is answering a sacred calling to provide high-quality (albeit expensive) bananas. The thing is Charlie can’t force the rest of us to join his mission–only government can–and it does, a lot. If you limit the role of government to protecting the freedom of the citizenry (the only proper role of government), Charlie is powerless to force you to do anything.
3. Sorry, if you don’t like where you work, then you need to find another job or start your own company. I’m sure your intentions are good and you will make an excellent product or provide an excellent service, but I will never support you putting a gun to anyone’s head (i.e., using the power of government) to force him to buy your product or support you when times are tough. That’s what friends, churches, charities, and donors are for. (Guess how many I belong to!)
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The U.N….the CFR’s agenda…
Do You want these horses asses teaching your children this crap and ruining their innocence and their childhood…????
U.N. Report Advocates Teaching Masturbation to 5-Year-Olds
Wednesday, August 26, 2009
• Click here to see the report.
By the time they’re 9 years old, they’ll learn about “positive and negative effects of ‘aphrodisiacs,” and wrestle with the ideas of “homophobia, transphobia and abuse of power.”
At 12, they’ll learn the “reasons for” abortions — but they’ll already have known about their safety for three years. When they’re 15, they’ll be exposed to direct “advocacy to promote the right to and access to safe abortion.”
Child health experts say they are wary of teaching about the sticky topic of abortion, but stress that as long as messages stay age-appropriate, educating kids at a younger age helps better steer them into adulthood.
“The adults are more leery of [early sex-ed] than the kids are,” said Dr. Jennifer Hartstein, a child psychiatrist in New York. “Our own fears sometimes prevent us from being as open and honest with our kids as possible.”
Hartstein, however, who didn’t see much harm in explaining basic concepts that kids of all ages will have questions about, was baffled by some of the ideas the U.N. hoped to introduce to kids as young as 5 years old, who will be taught about “gender roles, stereotypes and gender-based violence.”
“I want to know how you teach that to a 5-year-old,” Hartstein told FOXNews.com.
WE need to ban the ACLU from lobbying and making policy in Washington DC too….they are behind this I betcha……..
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,543203,00.html?test=latestnews
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One of the testaments to the greatness of America, its faith in progress and its tolerance is the fact that judging by a lot of the wingnut posts on this forum, they must be allowing internet connections in insane asylums.
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Thanks for explaining how you showed up here.
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LOL.
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I ain’t the wingnut. Wingnut describes all of you paranoid schizos who think that the bogeyman is out there to get all of you.
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This information is not easy for any of us. Typical psychological response is to deny the truth of it with no research, no particular reason other than to safeguard the self from danger because it goes counter to beliefs (brainwashing).
Next is the research to know the facts for oneself.
Then adjust, maybe shock and fear (looks like paranoia)
Then is accpetance
then “How am I going to handle this?”
Then tell others
and prepare.
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Peter’s a wingnut himself, but doesn’t realize it. He’s the worst kind: He believes in nothing except uncertainty. He doesn’t believe in truth because he believes truth is relative. To him there is no objective reality and, therefore, no objective code for living–morality and ethics are completely subjective to him. To Peter anyone who claims he can distinguish between good and evil, judge one value against another, or see black and white is a “wingnut”. Peter lives in an illogical, contradictory world of gray and lacks the courage or intelligence to question his relativist faith.
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So let me get this straight:
- christine has gone though all the steps and is “prepared” and is just trying to save us all?
- Ellsworth: the truth is what you decide and no one can live in ambiguity? There is no gray in your world. That must be awesome! You will never be tricked, coerced, confused, surprised, unsure or challenged creatively. Yours is the BEST argument here because there can be no argument against it. Congratulations, you have chosen the winning side. But, if I believe you are not right, and you believe the opposite, but someone else agrees with SOME of what you are saying and SOME of what I am saying, how can that exist in your black and white world? How can there be NO uncertainty? Some people believe in chaos, and that this world is uncertain…but that is disruptive to your thought process, so it cannot be. Shut it out or shut it down. Yes, Peter can be a bit childish, but he is just illustrating his point that not everything can be explained through your objective code of morality.
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Sergio, is existence real? Are there objective truths and are those truths knowable? Is morality objective? Generally speaking, the wingnuts (and I) believe the answer to these questions is yes–even though some do not consider these questions quite so “philosophically”. And, yes, this does make us feel confident and certain. That certainty offends the wishy-washy relativists, like Peter. You may have wrongly inferred that I consider myself to be infallible–I don’t, not even close. But because I believe reality is knowable and ethics (i.e., a code for living) is objective, I am certain examination and analysis of the facts (especially into issues of the political kind) will reveal our mistakes and lead us to better and ultimately correct answers.
People like Peter, the anti-wingnuts, hold no definite positions, except for a certainty that they can never know anything (“You can’t know”, “You can’t be sure”, “What’s right for her isn’t right for him” are their catchphrases). They pride themselves on their lack of opinion and judgement and lambaste others who speak with certainty, rarely bothering to even address their arguments. (This person speaks with certainty; since reality is subjective, certainty is impossible; therefore, he cannot be correct!) Many people born to the 60s think this way and are teaching their children to think this way. Indoctrination in political correctness and moral relativism demonstrates the point.
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A work in progress…but check out what’s available.
http://www.livingquests.com
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EllsworthT: I understand what you are saying and what you believe in with respect to the knowable reality…but truths can be different for different people. And morality is not concrete. Or else you are just one of the masses following something that has been taught to you, and taught to the person before them and so on…How can you prove morality and truth?
I disagree that Peter holds no definite positions. He is making it abundantly clear that he does NOT support your views, or those of some other people on this forum. In saying he does NOT choose to believe one thing, does not mean that he has spiraled into lack of opinion or judgement. He’s judging all right…and so are YOU when you propose your definitions of Peter.
As you yourself would probably agree to: when you choose not to decide you have made a decision. Peter is just a little more open minded, I think.
A couple of morality questions (which I may already know the answers to:
- How do you feel about gay/lesbian people?
- How about sex before marriage?
- contraception?
- other religions?
- abortion?
- the death penalty?
What is your code for living?
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Read One in Three Nurses ‘Do Not Want Swine Flu Vaccine’
Guardian.co.uk (18 Aug 09)
Scientists Refuse Swine Flu Vaccine
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iN6mX-40gBo&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fsolari.com%2Fblog%2F&feature=player_embedded#t=281
Swine Flu Shot Increases Your Risk Of Getting Serious Brain Disorder
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bC0WenTKhcw&feature=related
#183 – Forced vaccinations? Just say NO!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ho5hY4C3ans&feature=fvw
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Half of GPs refuse swine flu vaccine over testing fears
Up to half of family doctors do not want to be vaccinated against swine flu.
GPs will be first in the line for the jabs when they become available but many will decline, even though they will be offering the vaccine to their patients.
More than two thirds of those who will turn the jab down believe it has not been tested enough. Most also believe the flu has turned out to be so mild in the vast majority of cases that the vaccine is not needed.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1208716/Half-GPs-refuse-swine-flu-vaccine-testing-fears.html
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I’ll read some of it, but you have to read at least chapter 1 in this..
http://www.huxley.net/bnw-revisited/index.html
Everything this guy talks about is coming true..
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I believe Brave New World is a proponent of the NWO.
Jane Bergermeister, on the other hand, lives in Austria and has file criminal indictment charges against WHO and Obama, supports our preamble, constitution in her arguments, a propenent of inalienable rights to LIFE LIBERTY AND THE PURSUIT OF HAPPINESS.
Zip to page 105 in her evidence for a moment to see BlackJack and then the following numerology, cultish explanations the NWO folks use to set up their plans to create crisis. This one hasn’t happened yet. But 911 and 7/7 did. Is BlackJack a coming event. Criminals like to display their work in the media. Like I said earlier…like a pyromaniac who has set fires loves to see their work of chaos and devastation televised. Heard of Bohemian Grove and the “cremation of care” ceremony?
Evidence as to the existence of the Illuminati – page 105
http://wakenews.net/Evidence_of_the_use_of_pandemic_flu_to_depopulate_USA.pdf
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I say just legalize marijuana and get rid of the health care. I’ll be happy.
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Maybe if we all were smoking pot right about now, we could make some sense out of all of the paranoid posts above written by the paranoid wingnuts.
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Smoking marijuana right now would be very good, good for all of us, good for you, good for me, good for all wing nuts, and our Ron Paul friends here then we all get a good nights sleep. I love the stars floating above. Have you heard the song Under The Stars by The Cure?
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If not you can go here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0ymh8wKxpYU
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkyJ53j_xqM
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Is peter trying to convince us,
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….. or himself?
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Actually, “persuade” is more appropriate
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As a vegetarian I say try this on our animals friends first and if they don’t like it than we know it’s no good.
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I think a brave new world is the exact opposite as what this author is trying to portray..
From 1938..
“What Orwell feared were those who would ban books. What Huxley feared was that there would be no reason to ban a book, for there would be no one who wanted to read one. Orwell feared those who would deprive us of information. Huxley feared those who would give us so much that we would be reduced to passivity and egoism. Orwell feared that the truth would be concealed from us. Huxley feared the truth would be drowned in a sea of irrelevance. Orwell feared we would become a captive culture. Huxley feared we would become a trivial culture, preoccupied with some equivalent of the feelies, the orgy porgy, and the centrifugal bumblepuppy. As Huxley remarked in Brave New World Revisited, the civil libertarians and rationalists who are ever on the alert to oppose tyranny “failed to take into account man’s almost infinite appetite for distractions.” In 1984, Orwell added, people are controlled by inflicting pain. In Brave New World, they are controlled by inflicting pleasure. In short, Orwell feared that what we fear will ruin us. Huxley feared that what we desire will ruin us.”
This is kind of familiar to what I’ve heard before on one of alex jones movies. You can’t take over a country using bruit force. Men are human and dictators die out. Total dictatorship exasperates itself and cannot last long because of the undesirable will of the people. Social control will come from stealth. It will come from something good rather than bad. The general public wont even understand that they are slaves while they sit at home and being distracted by the television.
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I’m not ruling out the possibility that what this author says could come true, but I can’t see any reason why the elite would want to kill us all off. They really wont benefit from that.. The economy would totally shut down, the elites money would become worthless and the government would have to make us slaves some how just to provide us with food so we could live. It would just be a total chaos, and that’s not desirable power.
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as the population grows and resources become harder to get, the government will be forced to take on extra rolls. This is what i see as whats going on now.. In the seventies we ran out of oil so we get into the wars like the iran-iraq war, desert storm, Afghanistan, and the Iraq war..
Health care is another resource that we are outgrowing. I just watched a PBS special yesterday explaining that the shortage of primary care doctors is the main reason why so many people go to hospitals which drives up the cost.
So the government is going to be forced to obtain these new powers in a “sea of irrelevance.” By how fast we are growing, it’s kind of inevitable.
I do see why the elite would want to depopulate the earth, but I think the government is just going to take the extra steps and responsibilities for the general welfare of the public.
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The actual book is crazy. Its one of the top 5 books of the 20th century. This is the Brave new world revisited written 20 years later. They are coming out with a movie in 2010 with leonardo dicaprio.
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What I hear you saying, sean, is that you do not believe in evil.
I will pray that your awakening is not overly rude.
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I do believe in evil. Kim jong Ill is evil, Germany was evil, the soviet Union was evil, Napoleon was evil.. That just gives the Government more incentive to grow the size of their military, to protect our country.
I think it is evil how the government goes into war for oil, and that is why I THINK we should have town hall meetings for the war instead of healthcare.
I predict Obama will end the afgan war soon. MARK MY WORDS
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Wish in one hand, shit in the other.
Let us know which fills up first.
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He will before his next term.
we will see how many million people die this fall from the flu. That is our test of evil.
I bet you more people will die from malaria this year than the swine.
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How many events must happen before we see the truth?
See the overall picture instead of just arguing over individula aspects. When you can’t see the bigger picture, by collecting up all of the evidence, you’re out of focus. …and your conclusions will be inaccurate.
Story…
There is a jar of ants and you are one of the ants inside the jar. All keep circling round and round. Ah, but the ant that stayed on the top rim of the jar can see more clearly the situation.
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I’ll believe you once a million people die from the swine flu.
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Please, you are not on top the situation. We are on totally different planets. I might look like an ant.. from mars.
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Christine,
I read parts of it….The Brave New World
I wonder if Peter has studied how to do Brainwashing!!!!!
Delores how are you doing….haven’t heard from you lately.
I forgot to mention you in my last post. Sorry, you and Christine, and Lou, and Survivor, and longshotlouie…. are about the only ones in here that isn’t trying to mess with our heads…..
Anyway, hope everyone has a good weekend!
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Hey sweetie! I’m doing well. Had my little babykins (grandbaby) yesterday and he spent the night. He is only 9 months old so he takes up alot of time and energy! He slept through the night but I didn’t! I was afraid I would roll over on him. He likes to get up and snuggle..lol
Just took my mother, whom has alzheimers, up to Missouri to live with my sis. She is a retired nurse, I am not retired yet!
Have had my hands full however.
I am still getting the emails from the companies wanting to contract me for the vaccines this fall. I haven’t answered them. Like I said, I am telling everyone else not get them. Just use common sense, eat healthy, esp lots of fruits and veges, good hygiene, Lysol the house, stay away from those who are sick if possible, etc…
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There is so much info now.
Jane Bergermeister is getting ready to present her case. I wish it was televised or I could be a fly on the wall.
One woman with the truth can expose and bring down all those who are guilty of lies and deceipt upon the entire world.
She is from Austria. She is defending our constitutional rights, preamble, bill of rights. It should make us Americans ashamed in a way, that someone who lives in a distant country is doing this work for us, as well as the rest of the world. A large portion of her evidence being presented rests on upholding our constitution and the rights therein.
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Don’t feel ashamed. Blame your parents and anyone over 40. Thanks to the inability of public schools to teach civics and American history most Americans are hopelessly naive about what liberty means and how it brought us the prosperity we still enjoy (yet can’t seem to throw away fast enough). Even during FDR’s reign, no one seriously believed healthcare was a “right”, or was anything that had to be provided by another person. Fast forward to the 60s, despite the unparalleled success of capitalism and its benefits to the planet, socialism–the tired tyranny of the past–once again became the new vogue for young people. And today our generation suffers from their actions, ignorance, and governance.
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No, all Americans have been suffering from a financial and political force that has been working diligently behind the scenes. Not many Americans have known about the elitist until more recent times. They are being exposed only recently.
This has nothing to do with age, so don’t fall into the brainwashing about age, gender, race. That’s all been created by “them” to create more chaos and divisions which will keep us divided and unable to unite into a much stronger force. Divided we fall.
Only recently did I learn that the Rockefellers set up the Department of Education. That told me a lot.
The UNITED STATES is a corporation, the government that was set up via the Act of 1871, a 10 mile radius called Washington D.C.
A slight of hand changed our original constitution from
constitution for the united states of America
to
Constitution of UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
Do your research. It helps to explain the favortism our current administration has towards other corporations. The seemingly illogical bailouts become quite logical. Not right, but logical given the true facts of our history. The capitalization indicates a corporation.
US CODE 15 (A)(B)(C)
“UNITED STATES” means –
(A) a Federal corporation;
(B) an agency, department, commission board, or other entity of the United States; or
(C) an instrumentality of the United States.
Such as in this legal case…
http://dc.findacase.com/research/wfrmDocViewer.aspx/xq/fac./FDCT/DDC/2008/20080104_0000010.DDC.htm/qx
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This site is absolutely impossible to talk with…
It’s like trying to communicate with piece of crap!
Yeh Christine…..by the way……I”m not talking to you…but I called my senator today and asked if he and his message takers were going to take the flu shot. The young man said, “NO” and he didn’t know if my senator was going to or not..he said he has never had the flu or taken the flu shot either one…..I said, well, what will you do when they Mandate that you take the flu shot….He said, “They can’t mandate you take a flu shot, there is no such law”
I said, well there is in Massachusetts…he said no they can’t do that….in other words.Senator Carl Levin’s office says they can’t make you take a flu shot………
I hope that is true for Michigan…..
These kids they hire in their offices are probably so ignorant and deceived that they don’t know what the head is doing,
they are just tail waggers for them!
Has anyone else called their Senators and Congressman’s offices??
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You can’t mandate the flu shot. They aren’t going to come to your house and arrest you if you don’t take it. Even if they tried to mandate it, not even a hundred million people would really end up taking it. It’s too much of a problem to enforce something of that magnitude. Besides, we have too many liberals and republicans in congress to allow that.
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They wouldn’t really need to mandate a vaccine to release a deadly virus. They can give it to one person and watch it spread. The government wouldn’t expose them self to that degree.
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Sean’s method of getting info is to argue, put you on the defensive so you will justify your statements and conclusions and thus give him the info he seeks. He’s ashamed to admit he doesn’t know something or thinks it would imply stupidity on his part if he simply asks a questions to find out.
Sean, you need to read the evidence and do your research before you speak honey. A lot has already been documented. They can give the virus in a 2-shot trial (the 1st shot weakens the immune system, the 2nd allows it to become “airborne”) in 5 cities in America during school,they will give it to their parents, who will in turn give it to their co-workers, which in turn will close businesses. They want the UN to take over the US goverment dear. Rob and steel what they can before that happens though.
They have already held the International Swine Flu Conference and discussed things like handling business procedures, managing chaos, how to handle those who refuse the vaccination. You’ll find the agenda at http://www.livingquests.com .
Jan, there are so many people who don’t know about this, so many. The less prepared we are, the more people will just follow “their” preparations and well-thought out plans.
Jane’s document of evidence is so informative. How this has been planned from one administration to the next, it’s incredible. The laws cover their actions, even tho they go against the constitution, preamble, bill of rights. They are pressing forward with the plan. They want that NWO…at any cost it appears.
Note…Jane is addressing the laws that go counter to the constitution. It is part of her argument in her criminal indictment charges.
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VR: Oh. You mean Ann Coulter. Got it.
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What ever melts your butter.
Bang them bones.
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Love you to death.
Take my shot, please.
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You mean that thorazine that your takin’?
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You must have me confused with your girlfriend.
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Which one? Dolores? or Jan?
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The one with the Adams Apple.
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Peter Love is action…….
Here’s an article from a scientist who Loves us….
The vaccines are far more deadly than the swine flu
by Dr. Mae-Wan Ho and Prof. Joe Cummins
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=14869
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I love action.
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I am beginning to realize that there are men out there in the world who should be locked up. These are the men who have been educated in our colleges and turned out on society as educated psychopaths.
Gaining pleasure in attempts to degrade and destroy and to dominate.
This has been a trend across our nation, this is the freedom they fight for…..with no realization, that they are inferior humans without a conscious.
I have seen that “breed”of people for years now……with a philosophy of life taught to them. The little boys and girls with “NinJa” in their heads have grown up and this is what we get now as leaders!
It’s being taught and implemented by the United Nations now and they are ruining our sovereignty………. the people’s freedom to be normal and to have a pure personality that God gave us.
When a society rejects God,and His precepts, then they accept the teachings of Satan…..bottomline…no higher thought but lower thought life.
As humans we look up or we look down. We look to our left or we look to our right. We have two ears…..and we decide inside our hearts or spirit and discern and this “breed” of people are disturbing our peace.
And the saddest most pitiful thing is that “They Don’t CARE”!
They can’t, they truely can’t……
It is up to us to stop thinking that when they rant “Yes we CAN”, to remember what THEY are talking about, is extremely different than what we are talking about or thinking that they are thinking about….they just want you to chant….to your own demise……
Have pity on them oh Lord and have mercy on us! Send your Holy Spirit to the world Lord……fill us with your love, give us a heart of flesh and pour out your Holy Spirit upon this land !
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Would it help if I told you that I love you too, Jan?
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Wow. Jan, you just lost me. I am open to listening to a lot of points of views, and even agree with some of your ideology…but you lost it when the word SATAN entered the conversation and your argument.
You basically are saying that the administration and Obama are following the teachings of Satan? That is out there…by the way, there are religions in the world other than Christianity, so to make a blanket statement about “God” is pretty selfish and naive, I think.
We’re not having a discussion here, just a bunch of rambling fools trying to push their beliefs on others so they can go to sleep at night feeling good about “showing them” on a forum that doesn’t make a difference in the real world anyway.
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You libs are persistent little suckers, aren’t you?!
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We’re lovers, not fighters.
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I have pms and a loaded gun. Anymore questions?
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I’ll try back in a week or so.
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Dolores:
In reflecting upon all of our back and forth on various issues, I flashed on a famous episode of “Cheers” in which Sam and Diane are having a very heated argument. Right as the argument crescendos, Sam says to Diane, “Are you as turned on by all of this as I am?”
Well, Dolores, “Are you as turned on by our heated debate as I am?”
Maybe there is room for “compromise” on the health care issue after all.
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Sixty years of compromising brought us to this point.
We are one straw away from breaking the camel’s back.
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And actually, it is totalitarianism.
We now have a dictator and crooks and cons running our country.
The difference with the rest of the crooks that have been running this country, I did say “the rest” no party distinction here, is that the thugs in there now, have a proven track record of anarchy, terrorism within the u.s. borders and they have no remorse and are actually proud of their destructive behavior.
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Who said anything about being pure?!
Who said we don’t need major overhauls in our government run programs?!
What, because we don’t agree with how it needs to be reformed, we are wrong? Same reason your leader won’t let anyone participate in working toward improving what is broke?
Why do you guys always spin everything?
You take a statement, mutate it and expand it into incomprehensible jargon!
Get a grip!
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Why so much anger, Dolores? Sounds like you might suffer from sexual repression.
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I didn’t read anger in her post.
Must have been your projection.
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Typical spin.
So healthy that I am able to laugh at you little peter. I’m sure “little peter” suffers from repression.
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Why do all you petty authoritarian personalities always resort to attacking the person? I didn’t say anything yet, about your small boobs.
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rofl!!! yeah, ok!
A Fascionista always elevates herself above the faceless masses to be recognized for the higher being that she is.
That sums it up pretty good, doesn’t it! LOL
Oh, my, are you sure you are peter and not, lalalala lola?
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Looks like the white flag. Good thinking after firing all of those blanks.
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Amusing to see a statist refer to others as authoritarian.
Babble On
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The so called health care debate. It is like the Wizard of Oz these days. We, the people, have no heart, or brain, or courage, and someone is behind the curtains pulling the strings. I hear veterans screaming “changing my health care is unconstitutional”, when they actually have socialized medicine. I hear people from the right cry out, ” We shouldn’t have reform because all you need to know is that the senators won’t get into this plan” when the government (the people
) pays for 80 percent of their plan right now. The average tax payer pays for all of veterans insurance, all of active military in the biggest socialist program there is, and they pay 75 per cent or more for every public official, school, fireman, policeman, politician and federal or state employees health insurance premiums, medicare for elderly and disabled, the portion that the government pays through taxes already. They also pay for the uninsured, those anyway who actually can get any health care if they need it. This accounts for over 50 percent of health care being paid by government and the rest of us are paying for it now.
For those who really don’t want government involvement, please state that you don’t wish to pay for this please state that the 45 percent of us who have to pay for our own insurance without any government help really doesn’t want to give health care public help for grandma or the disabled vet and all the above because we don’t wish to pay for it. But you have to say it and you can’t have it both ways.
I also see workers who don’t understand that private insurance especially through the work place is a government/corporation collusion scam. They don’t understand that they got together in the seventies with a plan, during the government instigated price and wage controls to allow corporations to give a benefit to employees that would not be perceived as a wage increase. Heck, if they would have come up with a plan to deliver food, instead of health care, today we would have food tied to employment, with 1300 for profit food deliverers with fifty thousand different plans for the food providers to wade through to ,,figure out if you plan would allow you to have steak or liver to eat, and heaven help you if you lost your job. They would probably have to do what insurance companies do today, pay 400,000 to every senator, millions for lobby and campaign, pay their executives an average of 14 million a year and spend the rest on advertising and billing to get us to buy into and pay for their plan . we would be stuck paying 200 dollars, for 100 dollar bag of food.And we would have people demanding we don’t change it.
National health insurance is the only way to go. Not Obama plan, Not what we have. More later
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Thank you, thank you, thank you, Dan Hughes for saying all of that. No, Mr. and Mrs. America, you can’t have it both ways. If you truly oppose “socialized” medicine, then, in order to be ideologically pure, you have to oppose medicare, VA benefits to the military and retired military, and tax subsidies to employers and employees who purchase health insurance. No government involvement at all. Moreover, in order to be ideologically pure to the notion of personal responsibility, if an impecunious, uninsured health care patient shows up at the door of the ER, the doors must be locked to that person so that they die in the gutter and do not impose their failure to be financially responsible on the rest of society. (Unless, of course, the hospital, the doctors and the nurses decide to treat that person out of a pure sense of altruism, which does not get disguised as redistributing that particular cost and expense throughout the rest of the system.)
Thanks again, Mr. Hughes for distilling the economic realities and the philosophical and political hypocrisies of the debate.
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If we can’t be ‘pure’ then we must go headlong into more socialism?
The naivete is scary.
Having benefits for those that serve their country has nothing to do with socialism.
Tax subsidies are not socialist, but taxes on human labor and personal property are, assuredly.
The statists are fighting for their lives, in realization that the people have been awakened to the extreme Left turn that this country has made over the last few generations. They must hammer the final nails soon, or be left on the scrap heap of history.
When you shine the light, the rats do scurry.
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How pray tell is the furnishing of “tax subsidies” not an act of the government, and therefore, not an endeavor to centrally manage an economy, which is the essence of “socialism?”
Funny how the definition of “socialism” varies with the situation. “Don’t give anyone else any governmental largesse, but don’t touch mine.”
C’mon now, time for a little philosophical purity, for a change. More philosophical purity, less naked selfishness.
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As usual, the statist cannot distinguish between symptom and causation. Just another reason to keep them out of healthcare.
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Speaking of incomprehensible jargon . . . and name-calling, to boot. I am not a statist. I am a fascionista.
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Applying his own scarlet letter. Nice.
Recognizing his own inability to comprehend. Priceless.
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herewegoagain,
Too many voices flying around not making connections. The VA is socialist. Don’t just complain that I, who pay 100 percent of my own premiums at 750.00 a month and could get canceled next month with the private insurer due to my congestive heart failure (keeping me from climbing roofs and repairing chimneys, thus making enough money to pay the premium) thinks that since I am also paying for veterans socialized medicine, the entire MILITARY system which is the largest socialized program there is, 75 percent of the premiums that the government sends to private health insurance companies for all their workers, including the politicians,and all the uninsured that the state picks up anyway is leading YOU down the road to socialism. 55 percent of peoples health care is already under government control and I get to pay for it. I however get nothing out of it. I also get to pick up the expenses for the government making employers pick up workers insurance, in the price of products I buy from them. That is collusion between big government and big insurance brought on by wage and price controls with a deal made with big business. Only 70 percent of the money that goes into premiums goes for paying for health care anyway. Doesn’t it matter that private health insurance companies take out 30 percent to pay for lobbying, campaign, CEO salaries, billing, and advertising and they did it by making deals with government? If you care about socialism really, or government control, then don’t whine at me, make it change by removing all government from the picture for all of those above who get assistance from the government for their health issues, and I mean grandma too, and make me stop paying for it,or realize that there is one area where the people (remember, government of,for and by the people could actually take place. Get the private insurers out of it, limit government single payer insurance to be a non profit holding pool and disperser of funds, without letting them have control of where and who you go to for your health care, and have them do something good for a change instead of bailing out to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars big investment firms that privatize wealth and socialize their risk. You can’t have it both ways and be intellectually honest.
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We have been brainwashed into thinking that health insurance, no matter who provides it, is a good idea and that this will be the reform we are looking for. The debates go back and forth between who will do it…
big corporate insurance companies or the government.
Now think about that for a minute.
Look at those 2 choices. Look at those options.
Now…only a sane person can see that NEITHER of them works for us! Have we not learned enough about big corp in the financial realm, and about the government we now have that is not FOR us, but AGAINST us, and runs programs into insolvency?!
What we need is health care that is between us and our doctors. Simple. No health insurance company. No govt.
Take the law off the books that prevents purchasing necessary medical drugs in Canada. That competition will bring the prices down. You have to ask yourself why our government shut off that option to us if they are sincerely trying to reduce our medical costs.
The government is running off a different NWO agenda.
The American people are trying to still live by the constition. This is the real underlying debate!
I believe big corp health insurance companies and the the proponents of the NWO have conspired together to narrow down our choices (in our minds if we choose to believe that’s all there is) so we will be pushed into the govt. run system.
But we can demand the end of the financial game of big corp in the health insurance industry and tell them to take a hike! Physicians lower their costs and all other medical services to affordable.
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No insurance… wow. I wonder how many people would die in the first day alone.. Why don’t we just nuke ourselves if we want to depopulate our country.
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You, Sean, have been brainwashed to the gills.
What you suggest is not truthful.
Like I said.
You are a waste of energy in this room.
You feed off other people’s energy.
Learn to create your own energy.
ONLY YOU can come up with a reason for being here.
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What i said is truthful. Everything I say is truthful.. A majority of the people don’t have 15,000 dollars to pay for three nights at a hospital. That is the going rate… Do you have 15,000 dollars? I really do hope you keep your good health. All of this is very unfortunate. I’m sorry for pointing out the obvious.
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Read EVERYTHING I said in my comment Sean, including the last sentence, and you will see your comments are a waste of energy, distortions and not truthful. As I said, Sean, you are not helpful, nor do you have a free thinking mind. Your mind is controlled, or out of your control, same thing.
Insurance is an added expense, no matter who does it, big corp or the govt with 31 additional agencies, many more government paychecks to cover by taxation + premiums.
There is a clause in the bill that says they have a right to review and adjust…premiums and coverage, annually. When the govt. needs money, they will adjust it, higher premiums, lower coverage. The battle of cost and coverage continues, not ends.
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Like I said.. I wonder how many people would die on the first day if we just got rid of insurance. Doctors aren’t going to lower their costs on the first day.. It may take years to bring down the costs and millions would die.
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Did I say which order to proceed in?
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It’s amazing to me how loyal some people are to their abusers.
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Christine
You talk of big picture. Government today is a corpocracy. Government is working as one with corporations. Can we agree on that?
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Dan, yes we do agree on that. Our government is a corporation itself. Happened in 1871, Act of 1871. little known. This explains a lot to me re: recent favortism, that seemed illogical, of our govt’s favortism towards corp bailouts and leaving us with the tab. Now I see their reasoning fits “their agenda”. Seems like the govt is becomming a large corp conglomerate…a little of this, a little of that…houses, mortgages, cars, health insurance, media…until they control it all. That’s their goal. Not ours.
“They” are playing off their NWO agenda.
We are still trying to play by the constitution.
We’re tryin’…Oh, Lord we’re tryin’.
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Christine,
OK, good. Can we agree that corporatism puts corporations in a preferred position compared to the individual by policies set up by the government? Also,would you and I agree that this is being perpetrated by both major political parties and many of the members of both parties benefit from this corporatism through campaign contributions to get them elected, and lucrative jobs when they are no longer government officials?
I am heading somewhere here.
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Yes, corps and the corp government work together, best buds in several industries. Laws/policies are working towards taking over farms even so they can force GMO, Monsanto food that lack nutrition. Laws/policies inhibit naturopathic healing routes, disrespecting the bodies own healing powers, because it cuts into the profits of big pharma including corp health insurance companies.
Few politicians use our founding documents as the basis to approve/disapprove of policies/bills for lawmaking.
Historically the campaign contributions for elections has been a problem. The FED was instituted for same reason.
Conflict of interest for politicians should be against the law. I worked for the state of WA and had to sign a document declaring if I had a job outside of my government position, checking on conflict of interest. They could actually force me out of my position or to quit my outside job to stay. Should be no different for political leaders.
Owning stock in the vaccine company that has the world frightened right now, has Obama lined up to make some bucks, as Rumsfeld with the sale of Tamiflu.
Lead on…
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Christine,
Yes Monsanto is a good example. We could look at another example. Ask why in a “free” country industrial hemp isn’t grown .Why this law? Who benefits from this? Anyone who is in the cotton, oil, pesticide, or lumber industries. We could look at who the winners are (where does all the money go?)in our so called wars against terror. Halliburton and Chevron perhaps (Cheney or Rice’s old flames) or we could look at who Obama has as Federal Reserve board head, A guy who led a company who recklessly led us into this financial crisis is picked to get us out and who does he bail? The same companies who made private profits, including his own, got bailed out with public funds. Private profit with social risk? This is not socialist, this is not free enterprise, this is corporatism. Right? This government corporatist system is everywhere and until we know that we can’t understand whats going on. The corporate media is part of this too.If you don’t believe it, look at how the structure of the democrats and media dismissed and left out Kucinich last election, and look what they did to Ron Paul. I say it was because, even as they are very different in some of their views, they both were a threat to corporatism. Both party establishments and the media couldn’t allow that
OK I believe the ones in power understand how to manipulate the people,to divide and conquer. This argument probably took place in the slavery days. It is just free enterprise. It is perfectly legal. I submit the health insurance for profit is simply free enterprise (I will explain) I understand both sides. Ellsworth,you make some sense or at least I understand where you are coming from philosophically . You understand govt involvement undermines free enterprise.I have not seen where you (Ellsorth) have a full understanding that what we have right now is not free enterprise, it is corporatism. Your writings seem to indicate to me that you think rules and regulations hurt the corporations when in fact the government’s laws put into place for the corporations advantage in many cases created them and protect them, which is unfair to many others. The government practically created the for private health insurance industry. The laws have been put in place to corrupt the health system way back in the 70s when the government and big corps started tying health insurance to employment. The government by instigating wage and price controls and then allowing corporations to circumvent the rules by offering employees benefits, knowing that health care is something the employee needs or will need in their life (How many of us over 50 haven’t at least once been in an emergency situation or have a health issue where they understand their life may have been extended by either meds or a health provider? point being, for many access to health care is just as necessary as food for most several times in their life even if basically healthy) Once a for profit delivery system created by government decree,is in place, a totally previously unneeded service becomes needed. A delivery system you must feed to be able to go get health care? The people have to have private insurance right? Tied to employment,some think only the lazy wouldn’t have it, right?Most of these don’t even pay all of their own premiums. Separate the folks into groups in their own minds. So now the government by law ties something everyone needs, or at least potentially needs with employment.This opens the door for what I can only describe as a scam where a for profit industry is developed by government intervention that its sole function is to be a middle man between the patient and the doctor, and make tons of money doing it. The only free enterprise there is the 1300 insurance companies trying for their piece of the government invented pie that the people now have to buy into or they can’t get health care. 30 percent of insurance companies money from premiums still go right off the top to keep their dream alive
(lobbying and campaign finance) billing advertising to spit the pie and paying executive salaries.What we have there is in no way true free enterprise. Remember, in reality, all health insurance providers are brokers, go between. To make matters worse, all government covered premiums go to these same private companies. This means government pays premiums, companies pay for politicians campaigns,Insurance companies cherry pick who they want and the rest fall through cracks and end up on public dole, corporate hospitals hire entire staffs to wade through 15 thousand different insurance policies and charge the patient for it, raise price of health care even more, or rather the delivery system that skims money off the top before we even get to the actual health care part of it..
Christine, you will use the term NWO but I will use the term Empire. Empire is not new. In this case since I see the currant system a government corporate health issue as one that built up practically a criminal system, I actually believe that a single payer insurance, or we could call it coop that includes everyone where there is no need for the 30 percent overhead is a good idea. About 85 people in congress support HR676 is a bill that if you understand corporatism actually takes power away from the govt and corporate monopoly. Needless to say the majority in both parties want it to go away,
It would make the government be little more than a disperser of funds and is the key to actually less government control,immediate savings in health care. We just have to come to the idea that a for profit health care delivery system (for profit health insurance created by government decree) is not a good thing.
(opposite of Obama plan or what we have today)
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Dan Hughes, yes, I (mostly) agree with your analysis. I dislike the term “coporatism” because it demonizes companies, which I see as nothing more than groups of individuals working together for a common cause. The problem is not competing groups, the problem is government, favoring certain groups over others.
Can you honestly blame an individual or group of individuals (i.e., a company) for wanting to use to their advantage the power of the government, a power we the people have granted, to achieve their goals, whatever those goals are? It’s much easier to pass laws than to compete in the market place. The problem is not the ambition (or “greed” as some prefer) of these individuals or groups, it is the power of government to control.
There is no safe middle ground between freedom and government controls, as we see today. A person who chooses to give up just a little of his liberty surrenders his rights and substitutes for them government’s arbitrary power.
Capitalism’s perceived failures are the results of America’s mixed economy–today’s dysfunctional and dangerous middle ground between capitalism and socialism. The consequence of government planners meddling with the economy breaks the country into various economic groups that, in turn, induce government to bestow special legal protections and privileges over others. Controls beget more controls, rights dissipate, and eventually freedom is lost.
There is only one fundamental political choice: Do you believe people should be free from government coercion and allowed to voluntarily choose with whom they associate, or do you believe government should be granted the power to control people’s property, wealth, and lives based on whatever code (good or bad) is set by those in power and those who influence them?
I have worked in healthcare and health insurance for several years. It is apparent to be that the current debacle is the result of government intereference in these markets at every level. And yes, the businesses themselves are partly to blame for demanding protection from competition. As Ron Paul said, “When one gets in bed with government, one must expect the diseases it spreads.”
Cut off government’s tentacles into business now. Return to the Constitution, re-embrace liberty, and the Free Market will start working again.
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When this vaccination is given and then it creates death, crippling disease and problems with fertility, the claims made to corporate insurance companies will be astronomical and put them out of business in short order.
Then, the only thing left will be
1. me and my doctor with reasonable prices for services, no government, no big corp insurance companies.
2. We’ll need to demand that they take the law off the books that makes it illegal for us to buy medications in Canada. That competition will bring the cost of necessary drugs down in America. Attack big pharma.
or
2. the government health care monopoly, controlling our lives, who lives, who dies, who gets treatment…under a system that will be horrible to work with, not reduce costs, expand the federal government, increase our taxes, reduce coverage as time goes, and run into the same financial difficulties as social security, medicade, medicare, and cash for clunkers. Their programs are not designed for us! They are designed for profiting the elite.
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Why is it that whenever the libs feel threatened and losing ground, they have to pay folks to “push” their agendas through? ie; townhalls. In an effort to silence “we the people” they were advertising on craigslist for activist to go to the the townhalls to “put a stick in the ant pile”
If it is such a good program or policy, why do they feel the need to “prostitute” it?
Isn’t it comforting to know they will pay you before they kill you?
Main stream media will not disclose facts. While we still have free speech, better educate yourselves!
From worldnetdaily:
“Feds go hog wild promoting swine-flu shots
CDC spends $16 million on ‘outreach’ to convince Americans to get vaccine”
With plush swine-flu toys stocked on its gift-shop shelves, citizens earning $50 to attend forums on the virus and an additional $50 for those willing to take a vaccine, it’s a $16 million swine-flu shot bonanza hosted by the federal Centers for Disease Control and Prevention.
As part of a massive public relations and research campaign, the CDC has been hosting as many as 10 swine flu forums in nine U.S. cities before Labor Day – and it is shelling out as much as $50,000 for a program that pays citizens $50 when they preregister and attend.
CDC pays forum attendees
The city of Somerville, Mass., announced it has been selected as one of the 10 national sites. Its full-day “H1N1 vaccination strategy and information session” will take place this Saturday and is open to 100 residents who register. Each participant will also receive a continental breakfast, lunch and snacks. For those who don’t speak English, the events provide interpretation in Spanish, Portuguese and Haitian Creole.
for more…….. http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=108035
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Yes We Con! Yes We Con!
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Anyway, I thought liberals pushed for women’s lip?
You can dish it out but you can’t take it.
What’s the matter peter, do I need to look like a man, act like a man, walk like a man and talk like a man, to be considered a woman in your world?
It’s never going to happen. I am feminine, not a feminist.
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Now your just confusing him, even more.
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I don’t think he can rationalize the difference anyway VR. Just read his remarks.
The elevator does not go all the way up.
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The stewardesses are comin’. The stewardesses are comin’. Head fer the hills.
The housewives are comin’. The housewives are comin’. Head fer the hills.
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My father was a Marine. I have learned to take care of myself, very well.
I can walk, talk, chew gum and shoot a gun, all at the same time, peter.
Now, what was that name you called me again, peter?
I am proud to be a woman, mother and daughter of a veteran who fought for this country. And I am, a fighter too!
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You peter, are deranged. You are also, ignorant and can’t spell.
Other than that, I am sure you are a nice……….little liberal troll who has lost his widdle way!
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“They” are coming to get you, Dolores, and you Jan and you Glenn Beck. “They” are going to swarm all over you and destroy you. Head for the hills.
Or, better yet, get your guns out at one of them there Town Hall meetin’ thangs and start a shootin’. Just start a shootin’ at them there Comonists, them there darkies, them there socialites.
Why haven’t you freedom loving patriots done that yet? What are you all, pussies?
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Sounds like Peter wants to incite unlawful acts.
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What’s unlawful about a shootin’ people up if’n it’s in the intressts of freedum? It’s a patriotic thang, ain’t it? What are y’all? Pussies?
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I perceive poor “little peter” doesn’t like women.
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The women are comin’. The women are comin’. Head fer the hills. They’re gonna overrun is.
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Keep talking, Peter. This will make an interesting deposition.
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Whatcha goin’ do about it? Prosecute me? You’d have to get the dreaded government involved in that process? And, you know about the gubmint? They’re bad.
The gubmint is comin’. The gubmint is comin’. Head fer the hills.
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Yep
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Peter you are such a pest. You are also a racist……….SSSWAT
So, how do we stop this? That is what I would like to see on this web site. Instead of the bs from the diversions of idiots who come on here. We don’t have alot of time. We will not make another election.
This is an independent web site. Unless these idiots want to jump in and help save the country, they need to butte out and go to politico or huffington post and spin over there.
We, WE, need to group together and put our heads together and formulate strategies on how to save our country and stop this destruction. While we can still make a difference before they silence us and free speech.
Some of you may not agree with me but I take what I see happening from other sources and check it out. Fox news, Glenn Beck is revealing alot of what most of us already sensed. He is being smeared by radicals and some conservatives as being nuts.
The fact of the matter is, he is researching and trying to warn us. I had already started putting the pieces of the puzzle together this past year and to know others out there, are sensing the same and finding the same proof of a government takeover, is not comforting, but tells us we need to ACT!
I have made a few predictions on this site. I have not been wrong yet.
We will soon be seeing martial law implemented under the guise of “health care crisis” or another fabricated reason to do this.
They are dismantling our country and our constitution.
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The socialist darkies are coming. The socialist darkies are coming. Fear for your life. Fear for your life.
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Ignore peter, peter, peter, Jan.
You know I am a nurse as well. I hear you and I concur on a multitude of your grievances. The whole system is messed up. It all needs to be restructured. But, not the way the socialist party wants to restructure it in the white house/congress/senate etc.
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They will push this bill through by playing on the sentiments of the people. It will be renamed again. “Edward (Ted) Kennedy” Health Care bill
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Jan:
Take your anti-psychotic medication . . . quick.
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Peter, peter, peter…….I was going to suggest you do the same.
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Jan:
And after the unwashed, uncivilized horde has completely sacked California, they’re coming to your state to steal your resources and they’re going to intermarry with everybody in your town.
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I’m too old,for any of that nonsense.
I never dated across racial lines. Not to say “they” didn’t try!
My college biology professor back in 1963 taught the first class on “evolution” (if we evolved from monkeys, why are monkeys not extinct! the law of seeds..e.g.plant a tomato seed and you get a tomato, not a banana!) reluctantly…and he also taught us genetics……we learned alot about mixing the races and what it produces genetically,and social challenges and stigma. We were also taught in college then about “white collar crime”, and homosexuality was a “aberration”. I don’t know what the hell they teach now!
Besides, this country is into growing our food, and sending our resources,overseas.
USA Depopulation Plans: via abortion and infertility via 36 baby vaccines and now with this flu vaccine..Read Robert Kennedy Jr. site on vaccines sometime…truth……
This is good site for a lawyer Peter…
The flu vaccine Invasion!
BIOTERRORISM EVIDENCE
http://wakenews.net/Evidence_of_the_use_of_pandemic_flu_to_depopulate_USA.pdf
http://www.livingquests.com/
Evidence of the Man-Made Creation of a Pandemic Flu to Depopulate
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Oh Sergio…..lets face it…I am just trying to make some sense as to what has happened to our country to possibly cause its destruction.
I too paid for and worked for my education. No Pell grants, no hand outs from Daddy, no welfare.
And no I am not an elitest, I do not genetically or ancestrally qualify for their cult..and for sure financially.
I”m tired of fighting Sergio…I”m 65yrs old…..and this world will be left up to your generation…..I”m all done figuring it all out. I have studied it and studied it and reflected on my own life way too much.
I hope you will be blessed in life with health and prosperity.
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The H1N1 Swine Flu Pandemic: Manipulating the Data to Justify a Worldwide Public Health Emergency
By Michel Chossudovsky
URL of this article: http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=14901
Global Research, August 25, 2009
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A email I just received….is this truth Sean and Sergio?
Let me get this straight.
Obama’s health care plan will be
written by a committee whose head says he doesn’t understand it,
passed by a Congress that hasn’t read it,
signed by a president who smokes,
funded by a treasury chief who did not pay his taxes,
overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and
financed by a country that is nearly broke.
What possibly could go wrong?
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Jan, where do you want to see healthcare in this country go? There is so much bullshit on this forum that I don’t even have a clear idea of what the Libertarians want…
The only thing I seem to pick up is that you want Government out of the way completely…but it seems to me that without some sort of regulation, the private system will just continue the cycles of greed, corruption and misinformation. What is going to make a doctor or hospital feel more charitable, as Ron Paul thinks will happen…?
Charity is a choice that often gets trumped by large sums of cash.
As for your email above–THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH EVERYTHING ALL THE TIME. Expecting this honest and smoothly-running system is futile and idealistic. I am an optimist and believe that people are good, but everyone has their bad points too. That’s the just the way it is. We’ll be in a much better spot if we ALL acknowledge that we are all WRONG and RIGHT simultaneously.
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You do not want the government to be in control of your health, your life. Believe me, it would be a bad mistake. There is a case you should be aware of, a criminal indictment has been filed against the World Health Organization and Obama + others.
http://www.livingquests.com
http://birdflu666.wordpress.com
http://www.theflucase.com
If you do nothing else but read the Evidence in the highlighted green box on the first website…it will open your eyes and the argument about government-controlled health care will be a closed matter for you.
When you are given only 2 options and neither of them work, has anyone every thought that the government and big pharma are conspiring against the American people together to push us more into socialism?
We need to seek a third option. Personally, I am for no insurance company! Just me and my doctor, with reasonably priced services, competing in the free market just like other businesses. All else added is MORE EXPENSE FOR US. We want less expensive care, not additional expenses. And we want privacy, no medical records online.
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Or people can die and health care cost can keep rising bankrupting our country even more..
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MOre people die yearly in our country from treatable diseases than the whole iraq/afganistan war combined, because the market chooses not to help these people. Either the government can or we can lose the war at home.
I’m glad you have the privilege to be in the situation where you don’t have to decide between food and medical bills.
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Again, the problem can always be tracked back to government intervention.
Conlige suspectos semper habitos.
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Jan:
Watch out! The uncivilized, unwashed horde is coming to get you from afar. They are invading. They are going to infect and dilute the purity of your breed, of your religion, of your culture. They are coming. Make sure when you sleep at night, you pull the covers all the way over your head to prevent them from finding you.
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Peter…..they invaded California big time didn’t they?
How’s a lawyer to make a living now out there…….?
OH. I guess your handling all the foreclosures, for Bank of America.
Well, you won’t be able to sue the government or the Pharmaceutical companies, for all the human damages done by the H1N1 Flu vaccine..No profit there for you…..How’s business with everyone broke in your state and living in tents?
If you work on contingency then maybe you’ll have to wait until they get a job……you’ll be lucky if you have any covers to pull over your head!
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Naw…Jan, forget the covers, just get a gun and learn how to use it!
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So, my question to you Sergio…did you receive healthcare while you were waiting? Who paid for your education while getting a good paying job? Who paid for your housing? Were you on food stamps? Did you have to verify and qualify,like an American Citizen has to do? Or just because you were from a foreign country you got and get everything free?
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I was a Resident Alien–and could have stayed that way if I so chose–all of my life…so I pretty much had all the benefits of citizenship. My parents had healthcare coverage and so I was covered through them. I took out LOANS (that I am still paying off) to go to college, worked several jobs at a time to pay for rent, food, etc while going to school. I have healthcare now through my wife’s plan. So no, I did not come here and take advantage of the system. I worked my ass off for everything I have. And I am willing to bet MOST immigrants come here and do the same thing. I have met MANY immigrants both legal and illegal, and most people just want to work hard, pay for the things they need, support their families (who are sometimes back in their home countries) and try to save to make a better life for their children.
So, nothing free for me.
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Nerobama is about to “change” all of that Sergio. Watch. Everyone who has been predicting the demise of our country due to his relationships and czar advisers, will not be happy soon. But then, it will be too late to do anything about it.
While folks are side tracked and attention is being diverted, a whole new government is being structured.
Ever wonder where the trillions of dollars are? It takes alot of money to do what they are doing.
Watch.
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Jan:
You said:
“The problem is…..when they get to this country…they still have a need to “stick together” and are prejudice against a Anglo-saxon. Unfortunately, It is hard for any of us to keep our boundaries and to get along…”
What’s your authority for such a generalization? Do you have empirical data that the “theys” of this world “have a need to ‘stick together’”? Or are you just making that up so that you can differentiate yourself from that other group, because they have different skin colors, different religions, different foods, different belief systems.
I would be willing to bet that a person who tends to generalize the way you do, deep down, way deep down, doesn’t like people who are different because of their skin color, their religion, their language, their customs, their food. Do a little introspection, Jan and see if that’s not the case with you.
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Sergio, I am glad you are a legal citizen of the US, you may have went through a waiting period for years, just like you would have had you moved to India or Canada or another country.
As I would have to, had I moved to anther country. I talked to a man in India, a HP computer guy for 5 hours while he and I fixed my friends computer.
He was a really nice guy, but he has an American job and he knew it. I asked him, if I were to move to India could I get free healthcare? He said , Oh no , you have to be a citizen to get free healthcare in our country.
Only citizens get those benefits.
Now granted my USA Medicare Supplement covers me, if I am in a foreign country. But, Rog, said that it takes a 5 year waiting period before you can become a citizen, and then you get all of the benefits of being a citizen; healthcare, and retirement. Which 10% , of your income is taken out of your pay check once a month, at the end of the month for everyone, and that pays for their free healthcare.
Let”s get specific Sergio. I won’t judge you…I”m judging our country……our business our government for bringing harm to their own …the citizens of this country.
So, my question to you Sergio…did you receive healthcare while you were waiting? Who paid for your education while getting a good paying job? Who paid for your housing? Were you on food stamps? Did you have to verify and qualify,like an American Citizen has to do? Or just because you were from a foreign country you got and get everything free?
This is our point here….
I enjoy all peoples! They are interesting to me. I like learning about their culture. But, its when they begin competing or defaming me at the workplace is when I see they are all here to take my job……the fun stops there. The total acceptance stops there. Homosexuals in the workplace do the same thing to us.
The government has made the minorities think they are special, I’ve done the same thing with them, treat them like they are soooooo special and then have them stab you in back.
I was born in the United States, as my ancestors were.
The USA is a melting pot. Most nationalities in the world, except for the USA, live in a country, who are all the same race,nationality,and religion……and do not have to and usually don’t accept any other…I don’t know what that would be like to live in a country like that…..the USA has all races and nationalities and religions.
The problem is…..when they get to this country…they still have a need to “stick together” and are prejudice against a Anglo-saxon. Unfortunately, It is hard for any of us to keep our boundaries and to get along… I agree it shouldn’t be like that.
It’s doesn’t seem right in my soul….but it also, seems like I am sticking up for my own self esteem all the time and fighting for my place in this world…life shouldn’t have to be like that in my mind. Now we have the Elitest’s in the USA who think they are only ones who have right here….and want to depoplulate all of us who aren’t in their group…..and love for us to polarize and fight amongst each other…..they acturally created this division several years back….divide and conquer plans are working….I feel some guilt to falling for their agenda Sergio.
But, this generation of Americans have seen it happening and have lived it.
We have all been deceived and we better wake up….its just like we citizens of the USA thought we had a two party government system…who disagree all the time…..which makes us think we don’t have a dictator system then…..but in acturallty now we are finding out that that is lie and a front…cuz who they bow to is the Elitest’s , the Illuminati, the One World Order…..so in a sense every country in this world is under their control and dictatorship, because even in China or Russia or Italy, or The EU or Africa…..they are all under the control of the UN Elitest’s agenda…..so they love to see us fight amongst ourselves because it keeps us from really knowing the truth….
So, Sergio your here, your a citizen…welcome to the American way of life……poverty,jobloss,slavery and the Elitest’s dictatorship! Are you proud to be an American now?
Delores, I agree with you and thanks for stepping in to the discussion. You are alot better at expressing yourself than I am, and so is Sergio….I guess I am still angry and am fighting for my freedoms…..I was taught by my parents and my faith to love all people and not to judge a book by its cover……and I never did until I saw that it doesn’t work for my benefit or livelihood
Now I’m dealing with anglo nurses who have studs in their tongues and have colored their skin from their wrists to their ankles with tattoo’s…..and venom comes out of their mouths..in the workplace, and ruining the professionalism of the nursing field.
At least the foreigners are polite, I’ll say that.
I will say too..when your dealing with all these different cultures in the workplace…its hard for Americans to find common ground……in order to get along..
Why is it so hard………all the time……I try to keep my mouth shut, and just cry when I get home.!
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You are so far away from the truth as usual. NO illegal immigrants get any benefits from the government.
You are assuming that he must of had help from the government and couldn’t of done anything on his own because he came from mexico.. You are a stuck up prick.
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OK, Jan. Not sure where to start, but here goes.
Let’s ALL OF US establish that we all want pretty much the same things: the rights to live, work, grow, explore, teach and raise our children safely, respect, and all the other things we as humans naturally want and search for through our lives. Great, that’s settled. Now for the details…
I don’t disagree with everything you are saying, but I do have a few points/issues /problems with some of the things you write:
1. You blame the Elitists for creating divisions that YOU YOURSELF are carrying on by separating yourself from anyone that does not agree 100% with your views.
2. You claim to “enjoy all peoples!” (except homosexuals–even if they are citizens?–and anglo nurses with piercings and tattoos) So, I’m cool as long as you like who I have sex with and abstain from adorning my body the way I want to–and have a right to…?
3. Not sure which world you are referring to that has all these one-colored populations that don’t accept anyone else…?
Sounds like you have some very PERSONAL gripes with very specific people and situations in your life. Applying them globally and then trying to spread your frustrations and inconsistent arguments to other people is EXACTLY what a Dictatorship or Elitist group does.
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